Modern Motorcycles... and Technology

Hard to believe normal operation causes alarms, warnings, voice alarms, or warning lights for no reason or that a car like acting up like that wouldn't put off a prospective buyer.

Note that some things like object proximity warnings, lane departure warnings, closing distance warnings, exit warnings, etc. can be modified or turned off by the driver in Vehicle Settings.

Here pictured are some results from vehicle technology that I embrace. Our new Mazda hybrid compact SUV getting as good as or better fuel economy than a 2014 Prius with 195,000 miles. YM, of course, MV.

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I'm a service advisor at an Acura dealership. Everytime you drive one out of the service bays they have proximity sensors going off warning you that you are going to hit something. I yell at them all the time and tell them to shut up because I can see the sides of the bay and I'm not going to hit anything.
Call me a Luddite but I don't want that crap on any of my cars or bikes. One little sensor goes out and it's $1k repair minimum. Useless stuff that just costs you money in the long run. YVMV.
 
I'm a service advisor at an Acura dealership. Everytime you drive one out of the service bays they have proximity sensors going off warning you that you are going to hit something. I yell at them all the time and tell them to shut up because I can see the sides of the bay and I'm not going to hit anything.
Call me a Luddite but I don't want that crap on any of my cars or bikes. One little sensor goes out and it's $1k repair minimum. Useless stuff that just costs you money in the long run. YVMV.
All the doctor sees is sick people. All a service writer does is move cars in tight places. If you’re not a doctor or if you’re not a service writer, you might see things from a different POV.
 
All the doctor sees is sick people. All a service writer does is move cars in tight places. If you’re not a doctor or if you’re not a service writer, you might see things from a different POV.
Well, I do a little more than just move cars in tight places but ....
I also deal with lots of customers that have technical issues that would never be a problem at all if all these new cars didn't have a lot of this tech.
 
It took me a bit of time figuring out how to defeat the HAS on my Wrangler; the whole thing began by realizing it was happening in the first place. When it didn't roll back, I thought one or both of the rear calipers were binding. Getting the thing to go [once engaged] took a fair bit of torque [clutch slippage], which probably contributed to the initial clutch failure, combined with the drive by wire [which never does the same thing twice], the high [3.21] gear ratio, 18 inch tires, first gen 2012 -2018 3.6 [poor low end torque] but by then, the barn door was open and so on.
I think that the HAS is a good feature; at least a good idea, I just couldn't master it nor could the LCFTSA, in fact she hated it.
In the instance of the [by now twelve year old] Jeep, who cares anyways, it's an old car, but it's a bit disappointing to learn that [twelve years later] the system hasn't become something that we just take for granted as an enhancement. I mean, wouldn't you love to just have it roll back a bit and lock. Then, when you want to go forward, not even notice that it happened in the first place.
Backing my bikes down my driveway in soft gravel I rely primarily on the front calipers, but [of course] I leave them in first gear and slip the clutch to effectively brake with the leading tire; the rear, so for me, all of that just wouldn't work.
 
Well, I do a little more than just move cars in tight places but ....
I also deal with lots of customers that have technical issues that would never be a problem at all if all these new cars didn't have a lot of this tech.
Well, you don't see the customers that don't have all these problems but besides that what do you suggest we do Ray? Ride a collection of 30-35 year old Hondas and buy up all the unmolested 1986-1988 Integra 3 & 5 door lift backs we can find? That revvy 1.5 liter DOHC was a sweet motor in my '86 3 door. A few people can do that but it sort of is a problem for the auto industry.
 
Mine is an '08 and maybe doesn't apply, but I sometimes reset the wrong trip. The bike sometimes changes from my trip 1 preferred view right after starting it, and if I am trying to reset #1 too quickly, I sometimes reset #2. It's either that or somehow instead of a long single push to reset, there's an interruption in the long push so the display changes to #2 and then does the reset. I'm not sure which it is. Maybe both can happen, but on my Thanksgiving trip I was more careful and didn't screw it up.

So it was happening to me, too, and I don't think I'm stupid. A little slow maybe, but not stupid.
I'm pretty sure they show odometer at start up then switch back to whatever you had it set on, odometer, trip1 or trip2. Probably if your reset is jumping to trip2 then your not pushing the reset button firmly and its switching from 1to 2 then resetting. That's happened to me before.
 
Hard to believe normal operation causes alarms, warnings, voice alarms, or warning lights for no reason or that a car like acting up like that wouldn't put off a prospective buyer.
It does put off current owners. They come in regularly complaining about this stuff. As for prospective buyers- I suspect that most people don't appreciate the impact of many of these features during a normal test drive where their attention is focused elsewhere. Some of the salesman will also disable the most irritating features where possible before the test drive.

My Brother drives most of the day for work. All that he drives for work is late model Nissan vehicles, rarely more than a year or two old. Below are some examples that he mentioned.

Drive up close to something or another vehicle, like pulling up to a gas pump behind another vehicle, and it starts to squawk at you when it thinks that you are getting to close. Keep going and the auto-breaking slams on the brakes stopping the car. On some vehicles it isn't gentle either he said. Your head gets jolted because it thinks that it is preventing a collision.

If any door is open when you aren't in park and it squawks at and you can't move the vehicle even if you want to.

Unlock the doors to let someone in or out and if you are not in park it relocks them right away on you. Many vehicles will only lock the doors when you release the brakes but apparently not all use this logic.

Move to one side of a lane to avoid a pothole, or any obstacle, and it starts squawking to warn you. Don't move back and the lane assist steers you back and you slam through that pothole.

Drive-by-wire shifters that will not allow you to leave the car in neutral and take your foot off the brake at the same time. If you do release the brakes the computer puts the vehicle in to park whether that is what you want or not. This one really pisses customers off because it makes it impossible to go through an automatic car wash. This feature can't be turned off. There is a process to override it but the process is purposely complicated to discourage people from disabling this safety feature. The result is that people can't remember how to do it and it must be done every time that it is needed.

Vehicles with keyless ignition that do not have a proximity feature to unlock the doors or an exterior button to unlock the doors. You don't need the faub to start the car but you still have to dig the faub out of your pocket or purse to push the unlock button on the faub to get in to the car. That is a real genius bit of design engineering right there.

There were a few other things that he mentioned but I don't remember what they were now. He told me that some features can be turned off but many of them can not be in the name of safety. Much of what can be disabled can only be disabled for that one ignition cycle, meaning that it must be done every time that the vehicle is started, which in itself becomes irritating as you must keep doing it over and over again if you don't want it.

I don't know which of these features are present on which Nissans. He mentioned a few models while telling me about this but I couldn't tell you which ones they were now.

He jokingly told me that he enjoys getting in to his old dumb car at the end of the day because he can enjoy a quiet nag-free drive home.
 
Here pictured are some results from vehicle technology that I embrace. Our new Mazda hybrid compact SUV getting as good as or better fuel economy than a 2014 Prius with 195,000 miles.
The hybrid part probably operates independently on its own without the need of any driver input. It probably also doesn't interfere with the driver's intentions while doing it either. That is a big difference with some of the nanny tech.
 
From what I’ve seen here, the auto AND powersports industries are quickly, or at least inexorably, encroaching upon driver and rider enjoyment by adding all these “features.”

When will serious and effective consumer pushback begin?

At least on my GSA, I can disable the Hill Start Assist, Traction Control, and the other devices. For now.
 
When will serious and effective consumer pushback begin?
Already happening...
Automobile rags start negative reports; i.e. about why are drivers are forced to get distracted by having to dig through touchscreen menus for simple things like changing the A/C setting or radio station, whilst use of dumbphones is prohibited and placed under fine...
Also the issue of boosted ignorance and lack of situation awareness due to "safety features" comes up more frequently...
And that over-complicated, manufacturer only, closed systems are a clear violation of "the right to repair"...
Further have those option bundles gone out of control... i.e. electric adjustable rearviews being only avail in combination with factory satnav-stereo, cruise control, hence the full steering wheel control thingy, heated seats and the front plus rear PDC... and vice versa... one can't just pick one or two options, no you'll have to pay for the 5~6 others too...
Parallel to the increasing numbers of gadgets, the core qualities degraded, suspension coils simply break, suspension joints/bolts braking, brake rotors wear faster then pads, constant velocity joints falling apart, various sensors failing, wheel bearings fail within a year, etc, etc... the installed spares aren't of any better quality though...
 
It does put off current owners. They come in regularly complaining about this stuff. As for prospective buyers- I suspect that most people don't appreciate the impact of many of these features during a normal test drive where their attention is focused elsewhere. Some of the salesman will also disable the most irritating features where possible before the test drive.

My Brother drives most of the day for work. All that he drives for work is late model Nissan vehicles, rarely more than a year or two old. Below are some examples that he mentioned.

Drive up close to something or another vehicle, like pulling up to a gas pump behind another vehicle, and it starts to squawk at you when it thinks that you are getting to close. Keep going and the auto-breaking slams on the brakes stopping the car. On some vehicles it isn't gentle either he said. Your head gets jolted because it thinks that it is preventing a collision.

If any door is open when you aren't in park and it squawks at and you can't move the vehicle even if you want to.

Unlock the doors to let someone in or out and if you are not in park it relocks them right away on you. Many vehicles will only lock the doors when you release the brakes but apparently not all use this logic.

Move to one side of a lane to avoid a pothole, or any obstacle, and it starts squawking to warn you. Don't move back and the lane assist steers you back and you slam through that pothole.

Drive-by-wire shifters that will not allow you to leave the car in neutral and take your foot off the brake at the same time. If you do release the brakes the computer puts the vehicle in to park whether that is what you want or not. This one really pisses customers off because it makes it impossible to go through an automatic car wash. This feature can't be turned off. There is a process to override it but the process is purposely complicated to discourage people from disabling this safety feature. The result is that people can't remember how to do it and it must be done every time that it is needed.

Vehicles with keyless ignition that do not have a proximity feature to unlock the doors or an exterior button to unlock the doors. You don't need the faub to start the car but you still have to dig the faub out of your pocket or purse to push the unlock button on the faub to get in to the car. That is a real genius bit of design engineering right there.

There were a few other things that he mentioned but I don't remember what they were now. He told me that some features can be turned off but many of them can not be in the name of safety. Much of what can be disabled can only be disabled for that one ignition cycle, meaning that it must be done every time that the vehicle is started, which in itself becomes irritating as you must keep doing it over and over again if you don't want it.

I don't know which of these features are present on which Nissans. He mentioned a few models while telling me about this but I couldn't tell you which ones they were now.

He jokingly told me that he enjoys getting in to his old dumb car at the end of the day because he can enjoy a quiet nag-free drive home.

The hybrid part probably operates independently on its own without the need of any driver input. It probably also doesn't interfere with the driver's intentions while doing it either. That is a big difference with some of the nanny tech.
With confidence I can tell you I have never experienced your brother's problems but I haven't driven a Nissan since our 1987 Sentra. I guess that some of his Drive - Park nanny complaints might be rooted the electronic or by-wire gear shift controls. Mazda still uses a mechanical shift lever mounted in the console. I'm pretty sure Honda still uses mechanical gear selectors. If you want to leave it running in neutral and exit the car or go through a car wash you can still do that. Automated door lock modes are probably found in settings somewhere. Honda and Mazda's are. Lane assist and departure assist can probably be turned off as well. Honda and Mazda, at least the late model ones I have owned, allow this. It never squawks a warning or turns or jerks the steering wheel for you but will vibrate a warning through the wheel. Ignore it and steer around the pothole if you choose. Proximity warning issues can be nuanced between brands and models and relying on hearsay with one brand limits credibility speaking broadly. I did not like how our 2017 Honda Accord adaptive cruise & emergency braking/collision mitigation system overreacted in certain situations so I turned it off but Mazda in my 2019 - 2025 experience does a much better job with these. I leave them on.
 
Well, you don't see the customers that don't have all these problems but besides that what do you suggest we do Ray? Ride a collection of 30-35 year old Hondas and buy up all the unmolested 1986-1988 Integra 3 & 5 door lift backs we can find? That revvy 1.5 liter DOHC was a sweet motor in my '86 3 door. A few people can do that but it sort of is a problem for the auto industry.
How about putting them in accessory packages? You can buy them if you want. I keep cars for a long time. New cars are like computers, they are going to have big electrical repairs if you keep it long enough. Just give me a choice. Don't make me buy crap that is not needed and only adds costly repairs down the road.
 
How about putting them in accessory packages? You can buy them if you want. I keep cars for a long time. New cars are like computers, they are going to have big electrical repairs if you keep it long enough. Just give me a choice. Don't make me buy crap that is not needed and only adds costly repairs down the road.
Fair enough.
 
How about putting them in accessory packages? You can buy them if you want. I keep cars for a long time. New cars are like computers, they are going to have big electrical repairs if you keep it long enough. Just give me a choice. Don't make me buy crap that is not needed and only adds costly repairs down the road.
st11ray is right! my 07 Hyundai Tucson's radio is very staticky for about 5 minutes after i start the car. the ac relief valve is mounted inside the firewall and has a slow leak, (too much trouble to access and repair), also the Tires need to be replaced! These are all signs of preplanned obsolescence!!!
My 1960 Frog eyed Sprite had none of these problems except tires and second gear had a broken tooth and it had leaking hydraulic dampeners on the suspension and excessive body corrosion and the V belt to the generator/starter was often loose------AAAHHH Disregard this post! I loved that little pos car.
 
st11ray is right! my 07 Hyundai Tucson's radio is very staticky for about 5 minutes after i start the car. the ac relief valve is mounted inside the firewall and has a slow leak, (too much trouble to access and repair), also the Tires need to be replaced! These are all signs of preplanned obsolescence!!!
My 1960 Frog eyed Sprite had none of these problems except tires and second gear had a broken tooth and it had leaking hydraulic dampeners on the suspension and excessive body corrosion and the V belt to the generator/starter was often loose------AAAHHH Disregard this post! I loved that little pos car.
My first car was a 1968 MGC built at the pinnacle of British car decrepitude. I did own it 8 years and maybe 100,000 miles. (will never know because the plastic gears in the Smiths speedometer bevel drive stripped nearly as soon as replaced) Having a mechanic for a father was essential to my long term ownership. that car taught me a lot about handling a sports car and doing my own car repairs. I loved it. Replaced it with a Fiat….. talk about dumb things we do in our youth.
 
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My first car was a 1968 MGC built at the pinnacle of British car decrepitude. I did own it 8 years and maybe 100,000 miles. (will never know because the plastic gears in the Smiths speedometer bevel drive stripped nearly as soon as replaced) Having a mechanic for a father was essential to my long term ownership. that car taught me a lot about handling a sports car and car repairs. I loved it. Replaced it with a Fiat….. talk about dumb things we do in our youth.
LOL... I had two FIATs: a 128 & a 124 Spider. They were fun to drive reasonably reliable but some of the engineering left me speechless. I replaced the starter on the 124 & the bolts had to go in from the back... between the transmission & the transmission tunnel. Luckily, I had skinny fingers back then. The real problem was that a simple wrench wouldn't reach (I don’t recall how many of the bolts) but I managed to get them tightened down using a socket with THREE u-joint adapters (two borrowed) & much cussing.
I swear I also found several relays which weren't connected to anything.
 
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