Here is photo of the area from that thread :
ST1300 Turns over but does not start
- Thread starter Rolando
- Start date
Here is photo of the area from that thread :
Blrfl
Natural Rider Enhancement
Well, I had a look at the wiring diagram, and I can't see one or even two sources of what might be causing you not to have DC present.
When you took your voltage measurements at the fuse box, what were you using for a ground? If it was anything other than the battery,
--Mark
When you took your voltage measurements at the fuse box, what were you using for a ground? If it was anything other than the battery,
--Mark
If you are referring to my 1100, that is a color matched Givi 52L top box and it was on the bike when I bought it. I think they are the highest quality with the exception of the key, which is easy to break if you bump it when it's in the lock.
OP
OP
(Lack of-)Progress report ? Tuesday 20090324
I'm not being very succesfull with this. Furthermore, I'm evidently not very good at measuring fuses properly. I'm going to re measure, grounding the multimeter to the batter ground post. Anyway, here is a lack of progress report for any of you kind people who may still be following. Once again, many thanks for your help and sugestions.
Done
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Checked condition of cables to ignition switch but could not disconnect cables going into it to check for current.
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Checked Fuel cut-off relay with multimeter ? clicks and gives 0 resistance when powered by the battery - ok
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Checked Engine stop relay - ok
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Went and checked all six relays next to the fuse boxes on the left hand side ? all ok
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Checked wire harness connectors to the instrument panel. (Removed wind screen and top black cover under it to reach them.) ? ok
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Removed ground wires bellow the bottom hinge of the top tank. No need to remove gas tank. A ratchet and 10mm socket fit fine. Cables can then be pulled out from the left. I sanded all contact surfaces carefully. When disconnected the bike behaved just the same way. This would indicate, if my reasoning is correct, that these ground cables could be the culprits, if elsewhere they are cut or disconnected somehow.
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Took pictures.
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Could not figure out where the plastic cap for multiple ground cables is. Can?t find it in the manual. Photos in the forum show the cap and replacement kit, but didn?t find where it is.
?[FONT="] [/FONT]As indicated in the forum the tilt switch gives a different behavior and is very hard to get to, so for now I?m leaving it out. (Lights and other parts not getting power would get power.)
Pending
It would seem the most likely culprit is a series of ground wires not grounding.
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Find plastic cap for multiple ground cables shown in corresponding thread mentioned in forum.
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Find a place to check voltage on ignition switch cables. (Couldn?t remove the ignition key mechanism. There could be some alternative to removing the whole front fairing.)
?[FONT="] [/FONT]When checking fuses previously I actually removed each fuse and measured only across the fuse connectors with the voltmeter. This is incorrect, so I must measure each fuse again, grounding the voltmeter to the battery ground terminal directly.
?[FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]For fuel indicator bars and dashed lines under also blinking continuously the manual suggests. (Have to find the diagrams to identify where each of these is.)[/FONT]
[FONT="]o[FONT="] [/FONT][/FONT][FONT="]Open or short circuit at the fuel level sensor circuit[/FONT]
[FONT="]o[FONT="] [/FONT][/FONT][FONT="]Faulty fuel level sensor[/FONT]
[FONT="]o[FONT="] [/FONT][/FONT][FONT="]Short circuit at the fuel reserve sensor circuit[/FONT]
[FONT="]o[FONT="] [/FONT][/FONT][FONT="]Faulty fuel reserve sensor[/FONT]
[FONT="]o[FONT="] [/FONT][/FONT][FONT="]Faulty combination meter[/FONT]
?[FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]Spark at plug.[/FONT]
[FONT="][/FONT]
I'm not being very succesfull with this. Furthermore, I'm evidently not very good at measuring fuses properly. I'm going to re measure, grounding the multimeter to the batter ground post. Anyway, here is a lack of progress report for any of you kind people who may still be following. Once again, many thanks for your help and sugestions.
Done
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Checked condition of cables to ignition switch but could not disconnect cables going into it to check for current.
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Checked Fuel cut-off relay with multimeter ? clicks and gives 0 resistance when powered by the battery - ok
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Checked Engine stop relay - ok
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Went and checked all six relays next to the fuse boxes on the left hand side ? all ok
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Checked wire harness connectors to the instrument panel. (Removed wind screen and top black cover under it to reach them.) ? ok
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Removed ground wires bellow the bottom hinge of the top tank. No need to remove gas tank. A ratchet and 10mm socket fit fine. Cables can then be pulled out from the left. I sanded all contact surfaces carefully. When disconnected the bike behaved just the same way. This would indicate, if my reasoning is correct, that these ground cables could be the culprits, if elsewhere they are cut or disconnected somehow.
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Took pictures.
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Could not figure out where the plastic cap for multiple ground cables is. Can?t find it in the manual. Photos in the forum show the cap and replacement kit, but didn?t find where it is.
?[FONT="] [/FONT]As indicated in the forum the tilt switch gives a different behavior and is very hard to get to, so for now I?m leaving it out. (Lights and other parts not getting power would get power.)
Pending
It would seem the most likely culprit is a series of ground wires not grounding.
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Find plastic cap for multiple ground cables shown in corresponding thread mentioned in forum.
?[FONT="] [/FONT]Find a place to check voltage on ignition switch cables. (Couldn?t remove the ignition key mechanism. There could be some alternative to removing the whole front fairing.)
?[FONT="] [/FONT]When checking fuses previously I actually removed each fuse and measured only across the fuse connectors with the voltmeter. This is incorrect, so I must measure each fuse again, grounding the voltmeter to the battery ground terminal directly.
?[FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]For fuel indicator bars and dashed lines under also blinking continuously the manual suggests. (Have to find the diagrams to identify where each of these is.)[/FONT]
[FONT="]o[FONT="] [/FONT][/FONT][FONT="]Open or short circuit at the fuel level sensor circuit[/FONT]
[FONT="]o[FONT="] [/FONT][/FONT][FONT="]Faulty fuel level sensor[/FONT]
[FONT="]o[FONT="] [/FONT][/FONT][FONT="]Short circuit at the fuel reserve sensor circuit[/FONT]
[FONT="]o[FONT="] [/FONT][/FONT][FONT="]Faulty fuel reserve sensor[/FONT]
[FONT="]o[FONT="] [/FONT][/FONT][FONT="]Faulty combination meter[/FONT]
?[FONT="] [/FONT][FONT="]Spark at plug.[/FONT]
[FONT="][/FONT]
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OP
OP
Originally Posted by jimjam
There's more than "lack of fuel" going on here. I'd go straight and directly to the common ground lug under the airbox. No FI light with the key and kill switches "on" is a big clue (assuming the clutch and sidestand switches are ok). Bank angle sensor is located right behind headlight nacelle, and is difficult to access without removing the whole headlight assy. When activated, it kills the ignition and fuel pump, but the headlight and turnsignals stay on (don't ask me how i know - aren't the tipover wings a great feature?). It also "resets" when the bike is uprighted - I think it is a mercury switch - but I'm pretty sure its not the problem. Virtually everything, including the FI computer grounds to the frame at the lug under the upper tank hinge. Connection of dissimilar metals to the Al frame can cause corrosion here, which is why the recall was initiated. I would disassemble and clean the ground lug before I went further. If that doesn't fix it, then check spark (both sides - two coils), as Maura suggests. No spark, along with screwy instrument indications would suggest computer (heaven forbid). Best of luck. Let us know how you make out.
There's more than "lack of fuel" going on here. I'd go straight and directly to the common ground lug under the airbox. No FI light with the key and kill switches "on" is a big clue (assuming the clutch and sidestand switches are ok). Bank angle sensor is located right behind headlight nacelle, and is difficult to access without removing the whole headlight assy. When activated, it kills the ignition and fuel pump, but the headlight and turnsignals stay on (don't ask me how i know - aren't the tipover wings a great feature?). It also "resets" when the bike is uprighted - I think it is a mercury switch - but I'm pretty sure its not the problem. Virtually everything, including the FI computer grounds to the frame at the lug under the upper tank hinge. Connection of dissimilar metals to the Al frame can cause corrosion here, which is why the recall was initiated. I would disassemble and clean the ground lug before I went further. If that doesn't fix it, then check spark (both sides - two coils), as Maura suggests. No spark, along with screwy instrument indications would suggest computer (heaven forbid). Best of luck. Let us know how you make out.
OP
OP
Success.
Thanks to your invaluable help, I've found the problem. More like you found it for me. Many thanks.
Because I had a lot of work this week, repairs were left pending. Today I followed the most recommended: The common ground connector:
When I managed to remove the insulating tape, there was a cracking sound. I was able to see the green cables all going in. The plastic cover is pink on this bike.
I had a hunch, with the cracking sound and decided to try the switch. The instrument panel lit up nicely, bright, perfectly. The gas pump could be heard immediately. The bike started up as soon as I pressed the starter button. GREAT.
Maybe the cracking sound was burn or molten plastic or something. Will have to find out. Probably the movement helped get a ground connection again.
Now there is the problem of fixing this wiring properly, before putting everything back. It does seem I will have to drain the top tank and remove it completely. I'll look carefully at the grounding cables in the pink cap and everything there. Don't have the replacement/repair kit, so will have to invent a solution.
I have one question regarding this for anyone out there still reading:
How would you suggest I make the ground connection better?
Once again, many thanks to all for your help. Much appreciated. :bow1:
Hope you're all having a great biking weekend. The weather here is great and my bike is parked in a shady place ideal for repair at the back of my apartment building, so I'm hoping to have the problem solved this weekend.
Take care. Ride safe.
Thanks to your invaluable help, I've found the problem. More like you found it for me. Many thanks.
Because I had a lot of work this week, repairs were left pending. Today I followed the most recommended: The common ground connector:
- Removed seat (both parts).
- Side panels and panniers were already off.
- Propped up the gas tank.
- Removed the top of the air filter housing.
- Using the "T" shaped screw driver for better leverage and a snuggly fitting tip, removing the bottom of the housing was also easy.
- As mentioned elsewhere, it's terribly important to avoid a screw or any metalic part falling into the engine. Since they are left open as soon as you take the rubber trumpets out, they should be covered.
- I had a bolt from the bottom of the air housing fall to the air intake tube. If I had turned the throttle, it would have fallen into the engine. Carefully took it out with a magnet.
- I covered each intake with a piece of sponge, cut out to approximate size. They fit snuggly and since they are one piece, can't leave debris behind. Furthermore, they act as a simple air filter if you need to start the engine for any testing.
- Others mention how hard the screws for the bottom of the air filter housing are: It's true. However, with leverage, as in the "T" shaped screw driver pictured and a snuggly fitting tip and not letting the screw driver move save with the screw, as in "apply pressure downwards strongly" they dislodge and come out. You can also tap not too hard on the screw driver for a minute at each screw to help, before turning the screw.
- Must remove the two rubber hoses attached bellow before pulling the bottom of the housing back and then turning to remove from the left.
When I managed to remove the insulating tape, there was a cracking sound. I was able to see the green cables all going in. The plastic cover is pink on this bike.
I had a hunch, with the cracking sound and decided to try the switch. The instrument panel lit up nicely, bright, perfectly. The gas pump could be heard immediately. The bike started up as soon as I pressed the starter button. GREAT.
Maybe the cracking sound was burn or molten plastic or something. Will have to find out. Probably the movement helped get a ground connection again.
Now there is the problem of fixing this wiring properly, before putting everything back. It does seem I will have to drain the top tank and remove it completely. I'll look carefully at the grounding cables in the pink cap and everything there. Don't have the replacement/repair kit, so will have to invent a solution.
I have one question regarding this for anyone out there still reading:
How would you suggest I make the ground connection better?
- Should I run a cable directly to the ground (-) post of the battery and connect this to the ground cables?
- Does the cable of the replacement kit go to the ground post of the battery? (If not, where does it go?)
- Do you recommend any specific point to ground additionally.
- Have you any suggestions regarding a good way to make a good ground connection. (To the engine block is a sugestion here.)
Once again, many thanks to all for your help. Much appreciated. :bow1:
Hope you're all having a great biking weekend. The weather here is great and my bike is parked in a shady place ideal for repair at the back of my apartment building, so I'm hoping to have the problem solved this weekend.
Take care. Ride safe.
wjbertrand
Ventura Highway
Congrats on finding the root cause. I bet the cracking you heard were electrical arcing due to the poor connection.
Posted via Mobile Device
Posted via Mobile Device
This really sounds like the ground cap recall and should be repaired for free by your local honda dealer. The kit should include a new ground cap connector and replacement fuel hose any any other parts needed for this repair. This is a known problem on early
st1300's.
Gary
st1300's.
Gary
OP
OP
I'm happily riding my bike again. I added an additional ground cable from the darkened corner cable which was the culprit. Geting a honda dealer here to actually hand me the repair kit or even do the job of replacing it is utopian. I might later get the kit and replace when i go in there for some other reason. Thanks again for your help. Hope this thread will be useful to others in future.
Rolando:
FYI :
This is the Ground Cap Recall Kit the dealers installed on the o3 & 04's.
http://stwiki.notonthe.net/twiki/bin/view/ST13/GroundCapRecall
FYI :
This is the Ground Cap Recall Kit the dealers installed on the o3 & 04's.
http://stwiki.notonthe.net/twiki/bin/view/ST13/GroundCapRecall
I don't know what to tell you. Maybe send it to the junkyard and get a new bike. Did I mention my wife calls my garage a junkyard. 
Posted via Mobile Device
Posted via Mobile Device
Bada-Bing!!
This really sounds like the ground cap recall and should be repaired for free by your local honda dealer. The kit should include a new ground cap connector and replacement fuel hose any any other parts needed for this repair. This is a known problem on early
st1300's.
Gary
My STealer in Singapore refused to repair it for me and insist that my ST1300 is not under their recall list. Still using the melted ground cap under my tank but has attached additional grounding attached to the fuel pump to solve the problem.
Had request to purchase to repair kit from US and almost everywhere in the world but they refused to sell it to me, said its a controlled item that is not for sale.
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send it to somebody here and they could send it to you?
Hi Panjang
Did you ever get this resolved by Honda? I am experiencing the grounding issue on my st1300 which was imported from another country.
Did you ever get this resolved by Honda? I am experiencing the grounding issue on my st1300 which was imported from another country.
OP
OP
I did a repair myself with cable, soddering iron, electrical tape.
I ordered the part from www.speedsupplies.com and the part number is:
[FONT="] 1[/FONT]
[FONT="]$9.44[/FONT] [FONT="][/FONT]
I'm planning on replacing my temporary repair when I get a round tuit. (I've heard round tuits are available somewhere and I'm hoping someone will send me one.)
I believe having my motorcycle repaired at the Honda dealer here can be dangerous apart from expensive so I avoid that.
Hope this is of use.
Happy riding.
Blrfl
Natural Rider Enhancement
It's interesting that you were able to get the part, because it used to be restricted.
--Mark
OP
OP
[The quoted post has been moved to its own thread: CLICKY --The Mods]
I'd sugest you copy this and start a new thread for it with the specifics.
This one was resolved as indicated above with the wonderful help of people onthis list.
I have since replaced my repaired cable with the ground cable cap and wire with the replacement part from http://www.speedsupplies.com/ They do have the replacement ground wire cable and cap.
I'd sugest you copy this and start a new thread for it with the specifics.
This one was resolved as indicated above with the wonderful help of people onthis list.
I have since replaced my repaired cable with the ground cable cap and wire with the replacement part from http://www.speedsupplies.com/ They do have the replacement ground wire cable and cap.
Hi Guys , newbie here. Cant really help as I have similar problem. Last year after helping marshall a charity cycle race when I attempted to start bike nothing. Saw that rear indicators and front side lights on. HISS light not blinking on my 2004 STX. Disconnected battery and it started but when the headlight was switched on bike died. After a few more incidents things got rougher. Was bamked over on a roundabout when it died again. After research saw the recall and brought it to Honda Dublin, Dave there a good guy. Fixed the recall part, no joy. After three days they contacted honda and Honda, fair play replaced entire loom. I was delighted. No more problems. They thought it was a matter of some coresion in some part of the loom. Happy days. Yesterday the same thing started. After a 400 mile spin parked up and the following day it turned over but the minute the headlight was switched on the thing died. Re set by disconnecting battery and again it died on the first roundabout, when banked. This time if you use indicators the bike will die. Have gotten onto Honda they are researching it at the moment but I have a bike that dies when you switch on headlights , indicators or on a long bank. Can anyone give me some ideas.
Nemesis -
I did a repair myself with cable, soddering iron, electrical tape.
I ordered the part from www.speedsupplies.com and the part number is:
[FONT="]32101-MCS-305[/FONT][FONT="] - GRD JOINT REPAIR KIT [/FONT][FONT="] 1[/FONT]
[FONT="]$9.44[/FONT] [FONT="][/FONT]
I'm planning on replacing my temporary repair when I get a round tuit. (I've heard round tuits are available somewhere and I'm hoping someone will send me one.)
I believe having my motorcycle repaired at the Honda dealer here can be dangerous apart from expensive so I avoid that.
Hope this is of use.
Happy riding.
Hi Guys,
I'm from Singapore and I currently looking for this part : 32101-MCS-305 GRD Joint Repair Kit. Is there any other shops in US sells this part other than SpeedSupplies? I've heard bad reviews from SpeedSupplies and I won't not wanna take to risk to order from them...
Cheers,
Jeff