Do I really have to adjust my valves???

leveredge said:
I was just thinking the same thing that silverbub posted. How would you know the shop actually inspected the valves or adjusted the valves if you don't know what the clearance is yourself? How long would it take for too tight of clearance to make something go wrong? Or if the clearance is at the bottom of spec. range, burn a valve or whatever.
Just some questions and random thoughts.
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I hear what you are saying but would you take your bike to a shop that you don't trust in the first place? If you trust them when you bring it in, you shouldn't have any concerns when you pick it up. In reality there is no way to know if they did it short of staying around and watching.

I have a mechanic I trust, but I don't know for sure that he actually does what he charges for. As others have said the only way to know for sure is to do it yourself, but I find myself taking my new bikes to the shop for work. I spend a lot of time working on my older bikes myself and just don't have the time or inclination to work on the new ones.
 
CZman said:
My very capable, slightly rotund, trustworthy Honda-certified mechanic wants $300 to adjust my ST's valves. I could try to do it myself, but it's those left-over parts at the end of the job that scare me. My 03' is coming up on 16k miles. Do I really have to shell out for this right now? Justification: When I took my 919 in (with 21k) for valve adjustment (same under bucket-shim thing) I paid $200 to have the guy show me that the valves were all perfect, and I flog the crud out of that bike. A Zumo is screaming my name, so that $300 has a better place to go, maybe. Sanctification: My wife says that I should forego the GPS and pay for the valve adjustment. Aside from the stupid stuffed animal on the back of her Silverwing, and her approval of my mullet, she is always right. What say ye?
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At 16k I had two shims that I needed to replace (the valves were out of spec.) and 5 that I brought back to center even though they were still in spec. You don't need to check valves, but what about your peace of mind.
You can always replace a burnt valve.
What is the old saying. You can pay me now or pay me later. Every other check of the valves has been in spec. I now have 52k miles on the bike. Next valve check at 64K miles.
 
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"the work order sheet did not show any new o ring charge for the timing inspection port, nor anything about new gaskets for covers, or anything about gasket sealer...so, i think my valves were not checked at all,"

I just did my 48K service last weekend. I have also done it at 16K and 32K. I have not replaced a single O-ring or gasket and have no leaks. The O-rings and threads on the timing port and crank port are greased and seal just fine. The head gasket only uses gasket sealer across the 2 half circles at the front and no where else and seals just fine. The factory service manual may call for certain parts to be replaced every time they are removed but who do you think is selling you those parts? All I'm trying to say is that just because you didn't see it on the bill doesn't mean the work wasn't done. It is time consuming to write down the numbers and time is money to shops so they probably never write any of that down unless something is out of spec and they need the number to calculate the correct replacement part. Once the work is done the scrap piece of paper is probably thrown into the trash with the lunch pizza box. If you don't trust the shop to do the work don't take your bike there to get serviced.
 
Byron is very accurate. I'm a shop foreman in an International truck stealership, and have been a tech for almost 23 years. Techs never write down any information except for scribbling calculations. A busy tech doesn't have time to keep all that info. There are also small parts that never get charged out, and others that are OK for re-use. If you don't trust the shop, don't take it there. The service department doesn't want a comeback that they have to eat, or a phone call from either you or Honda complaining. I would ask about warranty before they started the job though. If you don't see any shims charged out, they probably didn't use any because the valves were in spec. The stealership has to show parts on the original invoice on a warranty claim if there's a failure in the future. So that's why I always have critical parts charged out on my customer's invoices at my shop just for that reason. For instance, if my dealership did wheel bearings on a truck and there wasn't a wheel seal charged out on the invoice, we couldn't make a warranty claim with International if that seal leaked in the future, even though we had to remove (destroy) the seal to gain access to the bearing. The same part number that's on the original invoice has to be on the warranty claim. My shop would have to pay for that wheel seal renewal. International warranties all parts & labor for at least 1 year/unlimited mileage, if it's on the original invoice. I'm sure Honda has a similar policy.

sbB
 
Byron said:
No you don't have to have your valves adjusted but you do need to have the 16K mile service, a valve check is part of, if you want to maintain your warranty.

There is a good chance that your valves won't need any adjustment done but will the Zumo pay for any repair down the road when Honda says they won't cover you under warranty because the 16K service was done by them or by you?
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OMG my dealer the one that I know of that I would even think about letting 'em toouch my ST wants $600 for the 16K sevice and that's before any adjustments (if needed). I feel I'm geetting taken for a ride (so to speak) So I'm at 18k and not done yet and after reading the prior description of the job there is noooo way I'd try it. AAAAAGGGH! riding season is coming on fast...... Is that dealer service cost way out of line or am I just a little tight fisted???
 
ChucksKLRST said:
At 16k I had two shims that I needed to replace (the valves were out of spec.) and 5 that I brought back to center even though they were still in spec. You don't need to check valves, but what about your peace of mind.
You can always replace a burnt valve.
What is the old saying. You can pay me now or pay me later. Every other check of the valves has been in spec. I now have 52k miles on the bike. Next valve check at 64K miles.
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Chuck, that photo is of the right hand side valves, yet the gas tank is visible. How did you get the cam chain tensioner to loosen the cam chain?
 
Ugh! All this talk about $BIG for just basically a valve check (pull a little plastic plus valve covers) and shove in a gauge 32 times) is just outrageous. Then, they want MORE $ if they actually have to do any work.

Two hours max for the check (that's being generous) at shop rates should be <$200.

Peace-of-mind and cheap-a$$ mind set make me DIY.
 
Guys - the valve check is really not that hard. The most time consuming thing is undoing the plastic fairings. Popping off the valve covers and doing the valve check is actually the easiest part of it.

Even never having done it before and being hyper careful, you can do it yourself in about 2 hours. Only take it in if something is out of spec and then, it should be less expensive labor-wise because you've already got the plastic off.

Do the valve check yourself (along with the other 16K stuff), save your receipts and mark it in your maintenance log and you've no worries regarding warranty. Plus, you can use the money you saved buying farkles.
 
The mechanic is to busy to write numbers down at $100 an hour? Or is the shop to busy charging the book allowed 4 hours for a two hour job? I'm sure the mechanic had time for a pee and smoke break. He had time to write down the numbers. If I asked for the numbers and they weren't there, I would suspect they weren't checked. If it blows up before three years, Honda buys the repair and they get paid by you for the work they didn't do. After three years it's all on you or the extended warranty you paid for. Basically, they have nothing to loose by spraying a little Brake Kleen and wiping off the motor.

Tom
 
Txrebel said:
Chuck, that photo is of the right hand side valves, yet the gas tank is visible. How did you get the cam chain tensioner to loosen the cam chain?
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When we did the change we had the tank up on the prop rod. I had to wait a week for the right shims to be ordered. The picture was taken duing that week of waiting. It took two people to remove the cams. One to hold the chain tensioner with a screwdriver and the other to remove the cams.
 
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I just picked up a used '03 abs, and it ticked over 16,000 on the ride home, so I called around about the 16k service. Got one quote for $624 plus parts, and two for about $417. Another said $80 for the valves. I assumed he was talking about just checking the valves so I called back and he said his book was showing 1 hr to check and adjust, but this doesn't sound right. Kind of afraid to take it to him and get involved in a mess. Any thoughts?
 
bps said:
I just picked up a used '03 abs, and it ticked over 16,000 on the ride home, so I called around about the 16k service. Got one quote for $624 plus parts, and two for about $417. Another said $80 for the valves. I assumed he was talking about just checking the valves so I called back and he said his book was showing 1 hr to check and adjust, but this doesn't sound right. Kind of afraid to take it to him and get involved in a mess. Any thoughts?
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You can buy a Hot Cams 7.48 Shim Kit on ebay for about $75, give or take a few bucks. Buy the kit just in case and then check your valves. If none need adjusting then you're still hundreds of dollars ahead and you have them when needed in the future. :)
 
I will be checking the valves on mine this weekend, as I am ~ 130 miles away from 16k.

Hopefully it will be just that...a check!

If I find mine are out of spec, I may get in line for the loaner shim kit.
 
okmurdog said:
I will be checking the valves on mine this weekend, as I am ~ 130 miles away from 16k.

Hopefully it will be just that...a check!

If I find mine are out of spec, I may get in line for the loaner shim kit.
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Mark, if you have any out of spec, which hopefully you won't, I'd sure like to be involved when you start swapping shims. (pm sent)
 
Fred D said:
Mark, if you have any out of spec, which hopefully you won't, I'd sure like to be involved when you start swapping shims. (pm sent)
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Fred, I will definitely take you up on your offer. Thank you!! :bow1:

I'm keeping my fingers crossed it won't need an adjustment
 
Re: Do I really have to adjust my valves???

No, you can drive it till it dies.
 
okmurdog said:
I will be checking the valves on mine this weekend, as I am ~ 130 miles away from 16k.

Hopefully it will be just that...a check!

If I find mine are out of spec, I may get in line for the loaner shim kit.
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Preliminary Data -

I just checked the valves, all in tolerance except #2 fore exhaust...measures somewhere between 0.009 and 0.008 inches.

However, the bike is ~ 5 hours cool after a 22 mile ride.

I will re-check all valves tomorrow morning for the 'real' data.
 
Dude- if that's all the miles you put on in 6 years; you don't need the Garmin....you don't even need a map...or directions. :D
 
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