My very capable, slightly rotund, trustworthy Honda-certified mechanic wants $300 to adjust my ST's valves. I could try to do it myself, but it's those left-over parts at the end of the job that scare me. My 03' is coming up on 16k miles. Do I really have to shell out for this right now? Justification: When I took my 919 in (with 21k) for valve adjustment (same under bucket-shim thing) I paid $200 to have the guy show me that the valves were all perfect, and I flog the crud out of that bike. A Zumo is screaming my name, so that $300 has a better place to go, maybe. Sanctification: My wife says that I should forego the GPS and pay for the valve adjustment. Aside from the stupid stuffed animal on the back of her Silverwing, and her approval of my mullet, she is always right. What say ye?
Do I really have to adjust my valves???
- Thread starter CZman
- Start date
Imrubicon
Wannabe Squid
Ditch the mullet
Go for it as its good for your Bike .
I also have parts left over and therefore go to my dealer also but I want the extended warrenty to not be argued also
Go for it as its good for your Bike .
I also have parts left over and therefore go to my dealer also but I want the extended warrenty to not be argued also
The peace of mind should be worth the cost. Valve check/adjustment is one of those things you never want to skip on. I burned a valve on a street bike years ago, by not adjusting them (I was young and stupid). Never again.
I liken it to the old filter commercial, you can pay ($) the mechanic now, or you can pay ($$$$) later.
I liken it to the old filter commercial, you can pay ($) the mechanic now, or you can pay ($$$$) later.
+1 on the mullet!
+1 on the valve adjustment. This is very critical to the long-term reliability of your engine. Although there will most likely not be any actual adjustment necessary, just checking on all the top-end stuff is worth it.
This is a mass-produced machine, and although Honda's quality is 2nd to none (I work for a Honda supplier) I also know that the occasional "out of spec" part can get through. One bad valve/shim/rocker/spring/cam face can cause havoc in any modern engine.
So fork it over! Then rest easy cause if it made it through the break-in with no problems, it'll prolly last a LLLOOOOONNNNNGGG time!
And besides, GPS technology is changing faster than PCs right now! New/better/cheaper stuff is just around the corner.....
+1 on the valve adjustment. This is very critical to the long-term reliability of your engine. Although there will most likely not be any actual adjustment necessary, just checking on all the top-end stuff is worth it.
This is a mass-produced machine, and although Honda's quality is 2nd to none (I work for a Honda supplier) I also know that the occasional "out of spec" part can get through. One bad valve/shim/rocker/spring/cam face can cause havoc in any modern engine.
So fork it over! Then rest easy cause if it made it through the break-in with no problems, it'll prolly last a LLLOOOOONNNNNGGG time!
And besides, GPS technology is changing faster than PCs right now! New/better/cheaper stuff is just around the corner.....
MileHigh
Juvenile delinquent
$300 Breaks down to $75 a year since 03.
That's a bargain in vehicle maintenance. Let the dealer do it. Save the money back up conserving gas by riding a well tuned ST.
That's a bargain in vehicle maintenance. Let the dealer do it. Save the money back up conserving gas by riding a well tuned ST.
Sink
TwiSTieholic
It probably won't need any adjustment... but what if it does????? Find someone to help you with it in your area if you don't want to fork over the ca$h.
Are you competent with tools??
pull off the covers and check the clearances. If they are in spec button it back up and ride on. If one is questionable off to the dealer you go.
You cant really have many left over parts from pulling off the valve covers.
BUT you better be good at what you're doing, a valve check is a lot cheaper than a valve job.
pull off the covers and check the clearances. If they are in spec button it back up and ride on. If one is questionable off to the dealer you go.
You cant really have many left over parts from pulling off the valve covers.
BUT you better be good at what you're doing, a valve check is a lot cheaper than a valve job.
skyboybry
Hi-Hi!
jasonJonas
Saver of Turtles
while i've yet to do a valve check/adjustment on the st, $300 seems a bit high. perhaps if an adjustment is required, but if the valves are all in tolerance, it's less work. ask him to price the work (check/adjustment) separately. if everything's within spec, seems he should cut you a break on the rate.
at $75/hour, that's 4 hours labor. is that reasonable for a competent mechanic? i don't know.
at $75/hour, that's 4 hours labor. is that reasonable for a competent mechanic? i don't know.
Love that picture!
I vote for have your cake and eat it too.
Find someone in your area to help you check the valve clearances. You are right, chances are they won't need any adjustment. You will have noted the valve clearances which is very important, have piece of mind knowing they are in spec and still have your $300 to go toward your Zumo.
Most people don't understand the valves could be quite a bit out of spec without ill effects as the Honda spec is ridiculously tight. Knowing how the valve clearances change over time is just as important as having them in spec. Here is a very good, short read on the subject (it's written about BMW's but still applies).
Ray
Find someone in your area to help you check the valve clearances. You are right, chances are they won't need any adjustment. You will have noted the valve clearances which is very important, have piece of mind knowing they are in spec and still have your $300 to go toward your Zumo.
Most people don't understand the valves could be quite a bit out of spec without ill effects as the Honda spec is ridiculously tight. Knowing how the valve clearances change over time is just as important as having them in spec. Here is a very good, short read on the subject (it's written about BMW's but still applies).
Ray
Having come from a highly modified 81 CB900F and vouch for this. The cb was a shim over bucket and rather easy to do. The specs where .002 to .006". Here's the problem: you take your bike to the mecanic and he measures .002. He's busy so that's good enough. .002" is virtually nothing. It made a huge differance on the old motors to keep the valves @ .006 or even .007. Unless you like replacing burnt valves.
I don't know what the ST spec's are but if they are that tight then don't ignore them and make sure the mecanic adjusts them if they are at the min spec.
I was wondering the same thing. I'm aways away from 16K with only about 7K on the bike but I was thinking I would at least take a look sometime next spring. I'm going to take a look at least even if I don't adjust them. I bought the service manual. Hell. I'll give a look. I'll probably just bug Ray about it if I can't figue it out!
My old V-twin was screw adjustment tappets and ended up being easy to adjust once I got to them. The hard part on the Aero was getting the valve covers off. Not much room between the cam sproket to the frame to remove the valve covers and not ding the cover gasket. I actually adjusted the valves on the Aero at 600 miles as was asked for in the service manual. The clearance was too tight on the exhaust valves of each cylinder. Dealer wanted $250 to do it. It did take some time to pull things apart and put it back together. I think that was part of the cost. At 8000 miles on the Aero the valves were right in spec. I did something interesting when I did the 8000 mile check. I got the whole thing back together but forgot to tighten the rear valve cover. Started up the bike and had oil smoke and oil all over the place. Pumped out about a cup of oil in a hurry! That was fun! The wife just shakes her head no. She's been doing that a lot since I got back into motorcycles.
My old V-twin was screw adjustment tappets and ended up being easy to adjust once I got to them. The hard part on the Aero was getting the valve covers off. Not much room between the cam sproket to the frame to remove the valve covers and not ding the cover gasket. I actually adjusted the valves on the Aero at 600 miles as was asked for in the service manual. The clearance was too tight on the exhaust valves of each cylinder. Dealer wanted $250 to do it. It did take some time to pull things apart and put it back together. I think that was part of the cost. At 8000 miles on the Aero the valves were right in spec. I did something interesting when I did the 8000 mile check. I got the whole thing back together but forgot to tighten the rear valve cover. Started up the bike and had oil smoke and oil all over the place. Pumped out about a cup of oil in a hurry! That was fun! The wife just shakes her head no. She's been doing that a lot since I got back into motorcycles.
I never took the valve covers off my 95 VFR in ~60,000 miles. I check the clearance on both my STs but haven't had to change a shim in ~160,000 miles (split over 2 bikes.)
The ST is easy to _check._ Do that yurself. If they are in spec, good, if not you can still have the mech do the work.
My opinion,
The ST is easy to _check._ Do that yurself. If they are in spec, good, if not you can still have the mech do the work.
My opinion,
No you don't have to have your valves adjusted but you do need to have the 16K mile service, a valve check is part of, if you want to maintain your warranty.
There is a good chance that your valves won't need any adjustment done but will the Zumo pay for any repair down the road when Honda says they won't cover you under warranty because the 16K service was done by them or by you?
There is a good chance that your valves won't need any adjustment done but will the Zumo pay for any repair down the road when Honda says they won't cover you under warranty because the 16K service was done by them or by you?
Thank you for the feedback. I will book the valve check.
"Honey, you were right about the valves, but look at this photo. Ye Gads, is that Whitesnake?"
2. Mulletard: An individual's unfortunate mental circumstance and glorious hair-do summed up in one word.
In modern usage: "I had to stop at a cross walk, to let the mullet pass."
"Honey, you were right about the valves, but look at this photo. Ye Gads, is that Whitesnake?"
2. Mulletard: An individual's unfortunate mental circumstance and glorious hair-do summed up in one word.
In modern usage: "I had to stop at a cross walk, to let the mullet pass."
Attachments
It's worth having the work done at 16K. Reports on this forum seem to be that it probably won't need adjustments and will be OK for the long term, too, but the consequences of a too tight valve can be serious.
Checking the valve clearances is easy enough, but takes some time. Adjusting the valves is a lot more difficult, requiring one to four cams to be removed. Your technician may be quoting a price for an inspection. My guess is any adjustments are going to cost more in labor.
Checking the valve clearances is easy enough, but takes some time. Adjusting the valves is a lot more difficult, requiring one to four cams to be removed. Your technician may be quoting a price for an inspection. My guess is any adjustments are going to cost more in labor.
Have the shop quote the full 16k service cost, or have them give you a cost estimate of the tear down, build up, inspections and fluids. I was quoted just under $500 for the 16k service, this included inspection and if necessary adjustment of the valves. If your bikes under warrenty the only thing you should be paying for is labor and fluids/brake pads.
Becareful, many shops will give you the maintance manual cost sheet quote for each operation. This costing includes tear down and build up, (pulling and replacing the tupperware). For instance, the 16k service calls for an inspection of all cooling hoses/clamps. You should not be charged a tear down and build up for the valve check and the coolant system inspection. Additionally if during the course of any inspection a Warrenty item is found, all labor and materials associated with that warrenty repair is covered.
In my case the Water pump seal was leaking. The seal replacement procedure called for the coolant to be removed. After the system is reassembled the procedure called for a coolant leak inspection. As a result I got a coolant change for free, and the cost of the coolant inspection for free, this including a tear down and build up. Bottom line I was quoted ~$500 and walked out at $380.
Becareful, many shops will give you the maintance manual cost sheet quote for each operation. This costing includes tear down and build up, (pulling and replacing the tupperware). For instance, the 16k service calls for an inspection of all cooling hoses/clamps. You should not be charged a tear down and build up for the valve check and the coolant system inspection. Additionally if during the course of any inspection a Warrenty item is found, all labor and materials associated with that warrenty repair is covered.
In my case the Water pump seal was leaking. The seal replacement procedure called for the coolant to be removed. After the system is reassembled the procedure called for a coolant leak inspection. As a result I got a coolant change for free, and the cost of the coolant inspection for free, this including a tear down and build up. Bottom line I was quoted ~$500 and walked out at $380.
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so, even if the valves clearance check is "farmed" out this summer in early september to a mech who has opened his own shop after workiing at a honda dealership(where i became aware of him) and he said "sure, i've done vfr(mine is a 94 with 20K) valve checks before, shucks, i even had an '86 vfr...great bikes!")...and after politely requesting that he write down the clearance of each valve while doing the inspection for my future reference points ...then, after a couple weeks in his shop he slid the work-order in front of me with a bill of just under $400...and said the valves were "all in spec..."...and did not write down the clearances..."too busy..."...so, unless i/you/we do our own valve clearance check...there is no way of knowing for sure, other than confidence & trust that the mech is working for you/me...or just for himself!...the work order sheet did not show any new o ring charge for the timing inspection port, nor anything about new gaskets for covers, or anything about gasket sealer...so, i think my valves were not checked at all, in reality,...and that i will just have to do myself the inspection on vfr & st to have absolute knowledge that the job was (is) done, other than just being shown a work order & fleecing a customer by some mech...
I was just thinking the same thing that silverbub posted. How would you know the shop actually inspected the valves or adjusted the valves if you don't know what the clearance is yourself? How long would it take for too tight of clearance to make something go wrong? Or if the clearance is at the bottom of spec. range, burn a valve or whatever.
Just some questions and random thoughts.
Just some questions and random thoughts.