Yea I'm waiting on the water pump cover parts to come in. Im hoping those do the trick but I'm doubtful. Ill probably end up taking apart like you did to find the leak. as for the 4 inches of snow where the heck to you live Alaska? Good luck, Mike Riley
Article [13] ST1300 - Water Pump Weep Holes
- Thread starter CYYJ
- Start date
Well, it looks like I have some work to do. I have not ridden the bike for a few months. I have started it up every week or so and let it warm up on the side stand. I started it and moved it the other day. As I parked it, I saw a small pool of coolant, maybe 3 ounces, under the front of the bike. I removed the right side covers and saw that it had been coming from the SQUARE hole. I thought the pump seal must be bad until I came here and read this thread. So, I gather the leak is probably a hose to or from the T-stat. Argh! Anyway, I really appreciate this thread. The workshop manual misleads you in a way. Since this hole is under the water pump, your natural inclination is to look at that section of the manual, and I saw no discussion there of the square hole. I assumed the water pump shaft seal must be bad even though there is no further flow at this point running the bike on the side stand. I guess there's no way around removing the tank, airbox and throttle body to get to the T-stat and the valley this hole drains. Thanks.
Sure there is you could ride over to Igofar's and have him fix it for you.
OP
OP
CYYJ
Michael
Hi Bill:
I agree with you, if you want to get into that "V" between the cylinders, you need to do quite a bit of disassembly. It's what we northern climate people call a "winter project".
Some thoughts for you, to help you in the planning process:
1) Removing the tank & airbox is pretty easy. Run the fuel level down to one or two bars before you begin, this will ensure that the upper tank is empty. If you have not previously done so, I suggest you replace the large "L" shaped hose that connects the upper and lower fuel tanks - yours is now 12 years old. See this post: ST1300 - Fuel Tank Hose Leak (Near Miss). The hose itself is not particularly expensive, but you might have to buy/borrow a specialized tool to open (expand) the spring clamps on each end of the hose - the clamps are in a very difficult-to-access spot, and although you might be able to get the clamp off with a pair of pliers, it's darn close to impossible to get it back on without a specialized hose clamp tool.
Also, on the topic of specialized tools, you absolutely, positively need to use a JIS screwdriver - not a Phillips - to disassemble all those snorkels in the airbox and to remove all the fasteners at the bottom of the airbox. If you try to do the work with a Phillips, you will wreck some fasteners that are extremely difficult to remove if the heads on the fasteners are chewed up.
2) It is a lot easier to get in and replace thermostat hoses (and possibly the thermostat itself) if you remove the radiator. Because you are going to spill a fair amount of coolant when you replace hoses in the "V", you might as well remove the radiator, if for no other reason than to make access to the thermostat and its hoses less stressful.
3) It's a lot easier to remove the radiator and get full access to the front of the engine if you remove the front wheel and the front wheel fender (you can see that there is a bit of "project creep" happening here, which is why we northerners leave this kind of stuff for the winter season).
4) It's murder to remove the throttle bodies the first time, especially if they have never been removed before. The tribal knowledge consensus here in the forum is that it's best to use a two by four laid across the frame to pry the throttle bodies off. Get a long (about 5 feet) two by four, you will need the leverage. You really do need to have two people present the first time you do this, if for no other reason than to ensure that the bike doesn't tip over when you are busting a gut pulling up on the two by four.
5) Take lots and lots of pictures at each stage before you start in on disassembly. For example, photograph the three little hoses that are attached to the bottom of the fuel tank. Photograph the snorkels (for orientation) before you remove them. Photograph the throttle bodies very carefully once you get the lower half of the airbox off, paying close attention to every little hose, cable, and electrical connector that goes in or out of the throttle body assembly. Lastly, once the throttle body comes off, photograph all the hoses and clamps from various angles so you have a record of how the clamps are oriented. When you put the clamps back on, you want the screw on the clamp oriented such that you can adjust it from the side or front of the motorcycle without having to take the tank, airbox, & throttle bodies off.
6) When you have the throttle body off, it makes sense to replace all the hoses that lead out from the 5 way tee, and to also clean that tee with a pipe cleaner. Once you have done that, you might as well balance the starter valves before you put the bottom half of the airbox back on, so, find someone locally who can lend you a manometer for that task.
7) You won't know how many hose clamps can be re-used vs. how many are beyond recovery until you take everything apart, so, allow time to order replacement parts in the middle of the project.
8) So far as time planning is concerned, if you enjoy doing your own maintenance and are of average competence, it will probably take you about 30 hours work to get the job done. Someone like Larry (@Igofar ) who has done the job many times could probably get it done in 8 hours. If you don't have a Honda ST 1300 Service Manual, I recommend you get one or borrow one from a fellow forum member so you have it on hand during the project - I referred to my manual often, and it saved my bacon a few times during the project.
Lastly, every step in this whole multi-step procedure has been well-documented, usually with photos, somewhere in our forum. If I recall correctly, I think I consulted about a dozen different posts that I found using the search feature as I was carrying out this project. So do a fair amount of searching and research here in the forum first, that way, you will learn from the mistakes of others, you won't have to make them all yourself.
Here's an example of what I mean: An inexpensive tool for correctly installing ST 1300 Throttle Body Insulators. There's lots more good posts like that here in the forum - it just takes some digging to find them all.Michael
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No need to remove the TB housings at all. Just pull the plastic (30 minutes) drain the radiator and remove (30 minutes going slowly) remove two bolts from support bracket across front of frame, then 2 bolts to remove T-stat cover and remove T-stat. While your there, remove hoses from fittings, clean them, replace the hoses and tighten the clamps, then refill with coolant, bleed air from system, and put it back together. Its about a 4 to 6 hour job working slowly, and cleaning things up as you go along.
However, if your OCD like me, you'll find all kinds of other things to fix/repair along the way.
Igofar
Andrew Shadow
Site Supporter
Don't really need to remove the throttle bodies. If you are not intending to do anything but get the leak stopped you don't need to remove much. Mine leaked due to loose hose clamps when it was brand new. Because it was new, I wasn't intending to do anything else. I managed to tighten the clamps by lifting the tank and removing the air filter housing and nothing else. Takes a bit of fiddling to get in there but with 1/4" drive sockets, u-joints and extensions, I was able to get to all the clamps that I needed to and stopped the leak.
If it is time for some preventative maintenance, its a good idea to get in there and take advantage of the opportunity as Igofar listed above.
Mike Riley and Bill B,
Good Luck gentlemen! I am waiting on honda parts now (thermostat, o-ring, head fitting o-ring and a couple of hoses). Got them from Servicehonda.com after checking 3-4 places. taking a while to make it to Denver tho. I got a couple of other o-rings from the local honda dealer just so I could go by and check out the place and those will arrive this afternoon.
I also got 1/4" heater hose from Napa to replace the 6mm hoses. those fit perfect. I picked up 3/8" heater hose (also from NAPA) to replace the 10mm hoses that go all the way back to the oil cooler. The 3/8 hose is not as tight on the fitting as I would like so hopefully it will not leak. the big problem is getting the hoses down the back side of the motor and connecting to the oil cooler. The 3/8 Napa hose is about 25% thicker so the outer diameter is larger which makes it really hard to fit. I would recommend buying those hoses from honda if anyone decides to replace them unless someone knows of a source for 10mm heater hose that is not so dang thick. Mine are in now so we will see if they work once everything is back together.
you can see in the pic the monster 3/8 hoses going in.
Happy Wrenching!
Good Luck gentlemen! I am waiting on honda parts now (thermostat, o-ring, head fitting o-ring and a couple of hoses). Got them from Servicehonda.com after checking 3-4 places. taking a while to make it to Denver tho. I got a couple of other o-rings from the local honda dealer just so I could go by and check out the place and those will arrive this afternoon.
I also got 1/4" heater hose from Napa to replace the 6mm hoses. those fit perfect. I picked up 3/8" heater hose (also from NAPA) to replace the 10mm hoses that go all the way back to the oil cooler. The 3/8 hose is not as tight on the fitting as I would like so hopefully it will not leak. the big problem is getting the hoses down the back side of the motor and connecting to the oil cooler. The 3/8 Napa hose is about 25% thicker so the outer diameter is larger which makes it really hard to fit. I would recommend buying those hoses from honda if anyone decides to replace them unless someone knows of a source for 10mm heater hose that is not so dang thick. Mine are in now so we will see if they work once everything is back together.
you can see in the pic the monster 3/8 hoses going in.
Happy Wrenching!
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Hi - what kind of mileage do you have on your ST?
May want to consider replacing the alternator depending on the mileage since you are that deep into it.
May want to consider replacing the alternator depending on the mileage since you are that deep into it.
Well, I went to raise the gas tank and it hits the switch housings on the ends of the handlebars. I'm certain everything original. What am I missing here? I know I have to remove it completely, but I thought it is supposed to swing up on the rear hinge. I have the support rod for that.
Oh, I think I have answered this for myself. I see that the rear is attached to a slotted bracket that allows the tank to move back. So, now my question is, what is the best way to drain the tank?
Thank you for all the additional suggestions above.
Oh, I think I have answered this for myself. I see that the rear is attached to a slotted bracket that allows the tank to move back. So, now my question is, what is the best way to drain the tank?
Thank you for all the additional suggestions above.
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So, you can get adequate access by removing the radiator? You still need to remove the gas tank and airbox, right?
OK, no need to answer this. I am pretty competent at working on vehicles, and I have all the manuals. I just jumped into to this without much reading thinking this can't be too complicated. After all I've owned and repaired two Honda CBX's for decades. Try a valve adjustment on one of those sometime. But in those, you pull the seat and there's the air filter. And there's no coolant to deal with, of course.
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I would like to see the answer to draining the tank. mine was full and I made a huge mess draining the top tank (three wet hoses, seriously?) My bottom tank is still full and every time the temp goes up in the afternoon the gas expands and it seeps gas past my rubber stoppers. gotta be a way to get gas out of that bottom tank (I mean, the engine does it)
Oh, wait. I have siphon. Duh! That should get most of it out of the main tank and then I'll run the motor a bit.
46,000 miles. I will consider that.
Andrew Shadow
Site Supporter
See this post Draining both tanks.
@SupraSabre and @Igofar ;
What differences in results are there between your two methods of draining the fuel tank?
(Larry's method illustrated in the post immediately above.)
I think either will do the very same thing, that is gravity is working for you.
The fuel in the upper tank goes down into the lower tank, and when either of these hoses are open, the fuel will drain as long as the catch can is lower than the lower tank.
I just always use the vent hose, as its easier to remove, a little lower, and angled better to catch any spillage easier.
Six to one, half a dozen to the other.
I assume igofars it located in Arizona? But yes that is what it is looking like. I was able to change my thermostat and housing after removing the radiator but it was very difficult. Unfortunately I now have the same D hole leak. I am starting with a new water pump cover and gasket but I have my doubts that is the problem I will probably be digging into the dreaded V-spot. Also I haven't figured out how to view all the posts people are posting about doing this job. Like one of you mentioned about being told to heat up the boots on the throttle body to ease getting them off. I haven't ran across that post in these conversations. Any help might help
"Houston, we have a problem"
I picked up the head coolant fitting o-rings from Honda yesterday and when I went to put the left side on the following pictures show what I found.
BIG shout out to 970Mike from California for the suggestion to replace those o-rings.
I picked up the head coolant fitting o-rings from Honda yesterday and when I went to put the left side on the following pictures show what I found.
BIG shout out to 970Mike from California for the suggestion to replace those o-rings.
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A lot of people forget these o-rings and then wonder why there is still a leak?