Is the classic sport-touring motorcycle doomed to extinction?

Andrew Shadow

Andrew Shadow

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Link to an article that details the author's explanation of why the the sport-touring motorcycle is doomed.
Are Classic Sport-Touring Motorcycles Dead?

I'm not sure if the motorcycles that they chose to feature in their photo is the result of them considering the ST line to be examples of superior sport-touring motorcycles or if they chose them because they consider them to be a symbol of what is wrong with sport-touring motorcycles and why they are doomed to extinction.

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Andrew Shadow said:
I'm not sure if the motorcycles that they chose to feature in their photo is the result of them considering the ST line to be examples of superior sport-touring motorcycles of if they chose them because they consider them to be a symbol of what is wrong with sport-touring motorcycles and why they are doomed to extinction.
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I like to think the former.

"Honda’s V4 ST model is just one of the casualties the sport-touring segment has seen in recent years."

And I like the colors, both of which I have.
 
When Goldwings and then the ST first came out it was all about open road and scenic routs with some canyon carving. Very few were into BRD routes. There were no you tube adventure routes to watch. All that has changed with the internet. Videos and guides of off road adventure routes look difficult but rewarding. They take you to stunning views that the majority of people would never see but in pictures, and we all know it's rarely shows the whole picture. So adventure bike have a great appeal and are glad they are out there. Sport Touring bike will be around as long as we are, maybe. I for one would love own an adventure bike to do a BRD route but that time has come and gone for me.
 
It already is, and has been for a while. Mfrs no longer need to make a dedicated ST bike. They can slap bags or panniers onto another bike in their lineup without having to go through all the engineering and tooling to make a new one. The author cites numerous variants of the same bike to please different riding styles. Much cheaper than a stand-alone ST. Even the GW has a "sport" version that we refer to as the "ST1800".

What the new bikes don't offer is value: price vs performance. Our classic ST offers plenty of fun and utility for far less than the new wannabes. And thanks to great engineering, they are still relatively low cost to maintain when they need it.

As much as I'd like to own a new ST1800, there's no way I can afford it. And I'm quite happy with my 2000 ST1100. It runs, it shifts, it hauls lots of stuff, and hauls a-- when I want it to. And I barely spend anything on upkeep. My smiles per mile are pretty cheap, and no electronic GPS, EFI, 13-inch super OLED display or other crap to fail. It just goes.
 
The sad truth is not all changes are for the better, but what choice to we have? You can only run an old bike so long before you can't get parts anymore without having them made bespoke for $$$$.
 
Obo said:
without having them made bespoke for $$$$.
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Can you imagine a machine shop trying to reverse engineer a SMC or PCV (proportioning....) for anything approaching a realistic price? It is not that it is impossible, but a one off of a complex piece without the original shop drawings and CNC program makes it difficult.
 
I would say whether or not the ST market is dead or alive, we can be grateful we got in when the ST bikes were available- this past Sunday when on a walk, a rider with a new (2018+) GW passed me and that smooth opposed 6 sound got to me…went home and broke out the 94 for a very nice ride. I originally thought how nice one of the GWs would be, but then those thoughts faded as I rode the 94- 30 years old and still a great bike. Newer bikes have more stuff and better tech, but I’ll stick with old and reliable (and paid in full).

I will admit I was interested in the NT1100 for a while, but that never made it to the US. Looks nice (except has chain drive):

 
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Obo said:
The sad truth is not all changes are for the better
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I have to disagree... I feel the RT is the best bike I've ever had so far...

I liked my wings but they got long and heavy in twisties... I liked my STs but they were heavy all the time lol.

Those are personal comments that apply to ME. I've tried several other bikes V-Strom/Super Ten/Tracer 900.. they were all great as sport touring bikes and they all had positive and negative aspects when compared to the others.

Yamaha and Suzuki are the only manufacturers that even have a category called 'sport touring'. The others are sport, tour, street or don't even categorized bikes like Ducati and Moto Guzzi.

I think changes are good, many are safety related like cornering abs, slipper clutches, etc... I'll take all the help I can get.

Bottom line is find the bike that works for you and if not, look for a different one... once you fine a gem stick with it as long as it makes sense to do so FOR YOU.
 
Another factor could be the demographic of those with enough money to buy touring bikes. ie. older people like most of us. A more upright riding position and wider bars make for a more comfortable ride (at least for me). Let's be honest, very few of us can exploit something like an 800GS or Super T to their fullest extent on pavement, let alone rough roads. So to lament the loss of handling in the twisties (that some of us may do) is maybe more due to our imagination than anything else. That being said, I will keep using my ST for what it is good at. Touring on the winding 2 lane roads. Mainly because it does it well, it is paid for, and I can still handle the weight. Who knows how much longer that will be.

I just finished 2 weeks in the NW of Spain on an NC750X. Turns out to have been a great bike for the roads we went on (narrow 1.5-2 lane, very twisty). It had a TON of luggage capacity, more than ample power (if kept above 4k rpm), could cruise comfortably at 80-90 on the freeway. I could see replacing the ST with something akin to that when/if the time comes.

I did 6,000 miles with my Tuareg this summer. 2/3 of it on pavement. It worked great for that although. Downside is I used soft luggage but that could be solved if required. Certainly could not have done the trip with my ST due to the 1,000 miles of gravel (although there are those that have).

The BB used to be defined as a Sports Touring bikes. I could not use mine for that anymore. Couple of hundred miles and I need to get off. Too old for that. Sure is a fun 200 miles though!!

So.....Touring bikes are not dead. They are just being redefined based on many factors; not the least of which is market.
 
Obo said:
OK, let me clarify @Mellow - the new tech can be nice as well as features and creature comforts, but some of the looks.... OMG what are they thinking? Aesthetics of designer folks on shrooms??
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Yeah, I guess... I've never looked at the styling all that much. I do hate when one headlight is low beam and one is high... that has always irked me... many hate the looks of the current RT, I really like it.. I actually don't care for the older 1200 RT looks but if I was interested in them at the time I probably wouldn't have cared as long as they got the job done and did it well.
 
Yep, the market has changed. So what? I will not ever own an "adventure bike". They are fugly, period. I do not, and will not ever need offroad, or even dirt road ability. Not in my mission profile. Regarding the statements that sport touring bikes don't offer enough performance, that the adventure type bikes do it better. Maybe. But do the adventure bikes offer a 250+ mile fuel tank, really good wind protection and nicely integrated had bags? To my mind, if I have to figure out better wind protection and storage, I've bought the wrong bike. Looks like the other performance bikes mentioned just canyon carving rockets with hard luggage. Sounds like fun, but will my wrists, hips and knees tolerate it for hours?

Consider also the cost of manufacturing. AFAIK motorcycling worldwide is becoming less popular. Emissions regulations are getting tougher. Manufacturing a 4cylinder, shaft drive, full fairing machine with hard bags is going to be a lot more expensive than a 2cylinder, chain drive, half fairing ( or less) with optional hard bags. Settling on one two cylinder engine family that can be used in multiple models, sharing parts, and more importantly, emissions controls, has to be a huge financial driver. Just look at the pricing of the few remaining traditional sport touring machines VS the ADV's. If I had to guess, there is more profit in the ADV's.

Call me a cynic, but markets may be based in demand, but demand can be manufactured. Used to be magazines, now its online, but reviews and reviewers are paid for. Social media is sponsored. The manufacturers are happy to sell something with a higher margin. And then there is the "look", the "lifestyle". Take jeeps for example, I see them everyday with offroad tires, jacks, winches, etc. the large percentage of them will never see a dirt road.

I'm alright with being a dinosaur. I'll soldier on with used machines as long as I want to ride.
 
rwthomas1 said:
Maybe. But do the adventure bikes offer a 250+ mile fuel tank, really good wind protection and nicely integrated had bags?
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Actually... the GSA can give you even more - I put 325 on the GSA in Colorado (and still had a 40 mile range) and though the bags are not typically included in the sale, my dealer threw them in for no extra cost and the top-loading bags are more functional than any side-loading bags I've ever had. Ugly, yeah I guess, but I like the looks myself.

Weather protection not as good as the RT or Wing class, that's correct but, it's pretty darn close. So close that it should be an options. The GSA is not the same as other ADV bikes due to range and weather protection so it does a good job of crossing into the Sport Touring category in my opinion. You also get spoked tubless wheels which are going to handle hitting a pothole better than non-spoked wheels.

I don't go off road if I can help it... that's fine as I didn't get the bike for doing the TAT.. I got it as a Sport Tourer and it works well for that, just like the RT.
 
That was a really interesting read Andrew, thanks!

I don't have the years or ability or breadth of experience that many here have but I took a gamble on the ST (I was coming back to riding after 35+ years off and had been reading that starting with a smaller bike was wiser) and it worked out. The ST is a perfect fit and does everything well at what I need it to do; fun rides, commuting and the occasional long distance tour.

At this point, I don't have the funds, the space or the signoff from the Administration to add another bike to the stable. Not that I haven't perused or priced out newer bikes :D.

At some point, I can see downsizing given the weight of the ST but hopefully that day is still a ways off.

What it boils down to is ride the bike that works for you.
 
Just glad that I was alive and able to own two of the best sport tourers that Honda ever made, a '95 and '96 ST1100, for 27 years of great riding. Honda coddled me through the revolutionary years from a 65cc "Sport" bike, up to what I considered the ultimate machine for the type of long distance riding that I preferred. Riding days are done for me now and I survived 58 years on two wheels, so I think I did the sport justice, thanks to Honda and have no regrets about hanging up the helmet.
 
Mellow said:
Actually... the GSA can give you even more - I put 325 on the GSA in Colorado (and still had a 40 mile range) and though the bags are not typically included in the sale, my dealer threw them in for no extra cost and the top-loading bags are more functional than any side-loading bags I've ever had. Ugly, yeah I guess, but I like the looks myself.

Weather protection not as good as the RT or Wing class, that's correct but, it's pretty darn close. So close that it should be an options. The GSA is not the same as other ADV bikes due to range and weather protection so it does a good job of crossing into the Sport Touring category in my opinion. You also get spoked tubless wheels which are going to handle hitting a pothole better than non-spoked wheels.

I don't go off road if I can help it... that's fine as I didn't get the bike for doing the TAT.. I got it as a Sport Tourer and it works well for that, just like the RT.
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I didn't mention BMW in my diatribe, but I thought about it. They are likely the only manufacturer left that seems to do everything really, really well. And the prices are eye-wateringly steep as a result. I have no doubt the GSA does sport touring well. Its also $25K. Thankfully BMW also still offers a real Sport Touring bike as well, and good on them for doing so. I have a feeling in a few years they might be the only one left, but that doesn't matter to me, I ain't got the scratch for that. I'll be swinging a leg over cheap used sport tourers until the end comes.
 
rwthomas1 said:
I didn't mention BMW in my diatribe, but I thought about it. They are likely the only manufacturer left that seems to do everything really, really well. And the prices are eye-wateringly steep as a result. I have no doubt the GSA does sport touring well. Its also $25K. Thankfully BMW also still offers a real Sport Touring bike as well, and good on them for doing so. I have a feeling in a few years they might be the only one left, but that doesn't matter to me, I ain't got the scratch for that. I'll be swinging a leg over cheap used sport tourers until the end comes.
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Absolutely, everyone will make choices depending on the parameters they are comfortable with.

A GSA or RT or some of the K1600s are right in light with Goldwings... some options of each will push the price of a wing higher than a k1600 and visa versa but the BMWs are generally a small percentage higher, just not always.
 
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