Information On Motorcycle Air Vests

Sadlsor said:
I've read vest-wearing rider crash reports where some had the wind knocked out of them when the vest inflated. One of them thought at first they had broken some ribs, when he could not initially breathe, but after 30 seconds or so, he recognized what had happened. This one rider was wearing the vest under his riding jacket, so that contributed to the effect.
Was that your experience, Danno?
Several vest-centric threads on ADVrider.
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Here’s distinguishing feature to look at:

What surface is stationary and in which direction does air bladders move when inflated?

The ones that inflate inwards would squeeze you!!! That’s probably what happened to guy that got wind knocked out.

Hit Air vest I had inflated outwards, so surface that contacted outside of suit stayed put without pushing inwards. But I still had wind knocked out from landing face 1st!
 
Andrew Shadow said:
You are also without it when and if you hit the ground hard as it only provides protection in frontal crashes like a front car airbag doesn't it?

I have been pondering these as well.
In a low side crash, be it high or low speed, besides being separated from the bike and hitting an object there is the possibility of hitting the ground before you become separated from the bike enough to activate the tether release. I am asking this from a position of ignorance as I have never seen one and don't know how long the tethers are, but in this case is it possible that the tether won't deploy the airbag before you hit the ground? If so, you may still end up with broken ribs. The electronic fall detection models likely would be more beneficial in this case if they got the algorithms right and if the electronics don't fail.

I realize that no one vest can possibly provide absolute protection in all scenarios, but while thinking about them it occurred to me that an airbag vest that has electronic fall detection as well as being tethered would provide the best of both technologies and would probably cover the most possible scenarios. Is such a version available?
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Andrew - I think the key on the electronic version is the 'if' and IIRC the E Helite states plainly it will not 'fire' under 12 mph unless you have the fork sensors which supposedly you cannot get in the USA right now. If that is the case without the fork sensors, in a simple parking lot tip over the E Version will not fire. The 'tether' issue seems to be where you attach it to the bike and how much slack do you allow. In my unfortunate experiences, I leave the bike pretty quick without any 'effort' on my part. ;) The E versions are based on Gyros, GPS, etc. and a lot of components working hand in hand - great when they work, not so much when they don't. And I think the difference in 'firing time' is in milliseconds between the E versions and the tethered versions - which probably does not matter much in the real world. The big issue is whether or not the unit fires at all and trying to make sure it does as much as you possibly can. I have testimony from someone who has had them fire twice with the tether - both cases at low speed, one pretty much a tipover. At the end of the day, you just don't know as every incident is unique but I think the odds are in favor of the tether to ensure firing at this point - which could change as technology improves.
 
Andrew Shadow said:
You are also without it when and if you hit the ground hard as it only provides protection in frontal crashes like a front car airbag doesn't it?

I have been pondering these as well.
In a low side crash, be it high or low speed, besides being separated from the bike and hitting an object there is the possibility of hitting the ground before you become separated from the bike enough to activate the tether release. I am asking this from a position of ignorance as I have never seen one and don't know how long the tethers are, but in this case is it possible that the tether won't deploy the airbag before you hit the ground? If so, you may still end up with broken ribs. The electronic fall detection models likely would be more beneficial in this case if they got the algorithms right and if the electronics don't fail.

I realize that no one vest can possibly provide absolute protection in all scenarios, but while thinking about them it occurred to me that an airbag vest that has electronic fall detection as well as being tethered would provide the best of both technologies and would probably cover the most possible scenarios. Is such a version available?
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The length of tether can be adjusted. It’s typically about 0.3m or less. You can’t even get off bike without disconnecting it first.

On my lowside, I was only about 0.5m from ground when tyres let go. What hit first was my arms, which dragged me backwards relative to bike. The tether yanked and vest inflated before my body hit ground! :)

Here’s articles from teammate that turned me onto Hit Air vest. With actual video of one in action! :eek:

www.rideapart.com

Crash Tested! — Hit Air Vest Review

Crash Tested! — Hit Air Vest Review Crash Tested! Hit Air Vest Review I hit a false neutral. I was cookin' through a corner that required to me be...
www.rideapart.com www.rideapart.com
 
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I have the KLIM airbag vest. I have had it going on three years now. I had a tethered airbag vest before the KLIM and hated it. The tether was always in my way and I would forget to connect it or disconnect it during stops for fuel etc. I aways worried about it not deploying if I did not get separated far enough from the bike in an accident. I looked at a lot of airbags vests before buying the KLIM. I was concerned about several things, how hot it would be, the amount of neck protection it offered and how comfortable it would be as well as rib protection. The KLIM when deployed does a good job of supporting your neck and helmet unlike some other vests.

Several tests have shown that the untethered airbags deploy faster and more reliably than tethered vests. The algorithms have developed over time and improved so much that the In&Box brain used in the KLIM has proven quite reliable. The entire KLIM system is made by In&Box company out of France. They have been in the airbag business for a long time and make airbags for auto racing, equestrian competition as well as avalanche and race protection for skiers. The airbag module keeps a charge for about 26 hours so it can last for about 3 days of riding. It goes to sleep if it is stationary for any length of time to save the battery. It connects to your phone via an app to monitor its state and provide the occasional updates. It can be set to call for assistance if it detects a deployment if you set it up to do this. It is very comfortable and have ridden with it on some pretty hot days without issue. It is made of a mesh like material which helps ventilation. What I like about the KLIM vest is it fits under your jacket, not on top of it. You do have to make sure your jacket is not too tight so that it fits under the outer jacket. It's nice to not have it covering up the outer jacket pockets etc.

The basic KLIM vest is about 400.00 with a monthly service fee for the In&Box brain of about $12.00 a month. If you pay the monthly fee the updates and box are covered under warranty. You can buy the box after a couple of years at a discounted rate. You can also buy the box outright without any monthly fees. The KLIM can be repacked at home without sending it in, but recommend that you send it in if deployed more than one time for inspection. They provide an air adaptor to inflate it with an air pump to inspect it.

So far I am happy with this vest and would not hesitate to buy another one. It has been reliable and easy to live with.

Dan

www.klim.com

Ai-1 Airbag Vest

www.klim.com www.klim.com
 
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No experience with a air vest but unfortunately experience with broken ribs. Very slow (going up a very rutted 2 track) tipover. Landed on my folded up arm and broke some ribs. I never left the bike (ie. I was still astride it, albeit, on its side). I am pretty sure that an airbag would not have deployed in my scenario; certainly not a tethered one as I didn't move much from my seated position.
 
UP and anyone else, I have been contemplating getting one myself and youtube has a plethora of reviews and/or testimonials to their use. I have come across 2 guys who had them used through offs. They loved them. Helite has both a tethered and non-tethered models. One of the guys at Blue Ridge had one of their non-thethered and he liked it but had not had the experience of it being deployed.
 
IMG_3449.jpeg

^^ Here’s my hookup- probably not the best way, but on the 1100, you’re limited- I guess I could have the tether come out from under the seat, but I have mine on the right handlebar so it won’t come off and will still yank on my vest in a separation. The little clip hold the vest connector in place when I’m off the bike. The ‘Rescue’ tag is to remind me to put it on when I start the ride (that’s the only thing bad about a tether is remembering to connect it but now it’s like a seatbelt- I rarely forget to connect it).
 
I'm on my third airbag vest. I had a Hit Air, then a Helite pre-turtle, and now a Alpinestars Tech Air 5. I like the shoulder coverage of this model. Runs around $700 or so. Electronic, but a charge is supposed to last 40 hours. It has to be sent off to CA to be recharged. Costs a little over $100 for the recharge. I much prefer the electronic vests. About 25 per cant of the time I would forget to snap the tether. In order to be effective in a frontal crash situation (hitting the side of a car that pulled out in front of you), the airbag has to be inflated BEFORE your body hits the car. The electronic airbag is so fast it will be inflated. The tethered airbag? Probably not. If you fly over the car they will both be inflated before you land on the other side. I wouldn't ride without one.
 
A couple of points. I have a Turtle 2 and have made sure it works properly twice. Both have been tip overs when i stopped the bike, once I did not realize how crowned the road was and there was nothing there when I put my foot down, the other time I decided to turn at the last second, began the turn and hit the brakes. Both stupid mistakes that happened when I was concentrating on something else and no harm done.

I don't think it is possible to get off the bike without triggering the lanyard. It is not that long, and both of my efforts to test the vest were right siders. Physics being physics, I doubt I'd assume greater vertical velocity in a real crash, and in both tests, my vest was fully inflated by the time I executed my perfect multipoint landing. I think it is important to realize that I did not separate from the bike until it was heeled over part way, so there is ample time to deploy the gas and fully inflate the vest before impact.

My take on deployment time (electronic vs tethered) is that it is not important for most crashes. I say most because any crash involving a direct head impact sort of makes the vest irrelevant. I mentioned my friend Steve, who died after a deer ran into his bike while he was riding in the afternoon at the BMWRA rally this year. He was not wearing a vest, but he was pushed into oncoming traffic and collided with a car. He was killed instantly. The vest would have made no difference from what I've heard. A better discussion would be how much protection? Full upper body and legs makes perfect sense to me but the cost is high and heat becomes an issue. Next on the list to discuss would be what exactly is protected? I cannot predict what kind of impact I'll have in an accident, so I chose a known, popular brand chosen by people I respect. I did my own due diligence read what I could online, and in the end could find no good reason to avoid the tether. I DID reject any brand that required factory repacking. (Heck, 50 years ago I tried skydiving. After the first jump we were told to repack our chutes ourselves, and an experienced club member showed us how. Did it again after the 2nd and 3rd jumps.) I also did not want to depend on batteries or electronics but could have been persuaded if the people I talked to had felt electronics were the way to go.

I consider the vest to be part and parcel of ATGATT. I always wear it, and the one or two times I rushed out of the house without it I felt naked by the end of my driveway, I stopped in the street, parked the bike, and walked back to get the vest. BTW, I have become adept at one hand clipping the lanyard (wearing my Lee Parks gloves) while riding. I do that less often now as I've less often tried to dismount without unbuckling. Both clipping in and unlatching have become second nature after a while.

Will every airbag system protect you in every crash? Of course not. Vaccines don't make that promise, in fact they guarantee that some small percentage of people will get sick. There are no guarantees in life. Anyone who believes otherwise is fooling themselves. Airbags increase the odds that you won't get a life threatening injury (just like vaccines will decrease the odds of having a serious, long lasting illness) nothing more than that. Phil, I recognize you don't want broken ribs, but no vest can guarantee that. Or jacket. If the factory says otherwise, get it in writing, have them put 100 million in escrow to back up that claim, and go ride. In my low speed slide/crash on my ST, my right foot was caught under the bike and my ankle was twisted and hyper extended (think bent down and back, but not enough to really tear anything). A vest would have done nothing for me then...my 'Stitch suit took care of everything else. In fact, I did break my fibula - lower bone between knee and ankle next to tibia.

Only improvement to a vest would be fabric sewn between the arms and your body and helium filled cylinders instead of CO2. Now (physics be da*ned) you have a lighter than air wingsuit so you can fly over obstacles and tall buildings in a single crash.:rofl1:

I'll throw this out. My greatest fear riding is having a crash and separation from the bike and either being shredded by the factory installed grater called guardrails or being squashed flatter than Woody Allen's purloined nose by a tractor trailer rig. So far no vest will protect me from either.
 
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jspringator said:
It has to be sent off to CA to be recharged. Costs a little over $100 for the recharge. I much prefer the electronic vests.
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The Helite tethered can be deflated and recharged in 2 minutes on the side of the road. Either tethered or electronic activation has pluses and minuses, plenty of internet info out there on both.

The electronic you are at the mercy of activation algorithms and power. The really good ones have a fork sensor also to further complicate matters but make them “safer”. There are several documented cases of accidental on the road activations, none that I could find on tethered vests. I can’t imagine accidental activation of the tethered but if it happens I’d rather it be when I forgot to unhook and tried to run into a bar or brothel than when I hit a good bump going down the road in the middle of nowhere.

Do the normal amount of homework and pick one - I did about 4 months ago and went with the Helite tethered. I throw an extra co2 cartridge in my bag for when I screw up. So far I’ve had no discomfort wearing it but in my desire to not look like road crew went with the black version; the only one to recognize that I was wearing it so far has been Raymond. :thumb:

Tom
 
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Erdoc48 said:
One more thing…will Redbird be reconstructed with plastics or become a parts bike (or maybe convert it to a custom ST1100)? How bad was the damage?
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She's toast - fairing stay demolished, all the front plastic destroyed (red and gray), speedo/tach busted, etc. and the real deal killer - it appears the forks are bent.
No sense to put a lot of time, effort and money into a bike that already has 179,000+ miles and would need a timing belt/Water pump in another 20,000 miles.
I've not been up to the job of taking a real good look at her at this point and probably won't be for a few weeks. ;)
Right now just breathing, getting up/down out of a recliner and on/off the toilet without screaming like a 3 year old girl who just saw a big snake are big enough challenges! :old1:
 
UP, I have used the Helite Turtle vest since 2019. I wear it over my Aerostich Roadcrafter R3 Lite suit. The suit has upgraded TF5 armor. Although Helite say it is not necessary, I also have the full backpad armor in my suit.

The bag has never deployed either accidently or in anger. I do carry a spare CO2 cartridge.

The only comment I have on how effective the vest is that a good friend of mine, Duane, who also rides a K1600, had a major accident last year when he was high sided off his bike at an estimated 60-70mph. Duane is a big guy but was thrown 10 ft up in the air and did a 180 before landing. His left femor was crushed in about 10 places after he landed on some large rocks and eventually was topped by a barb wired fence. He was wearing a Hardanger suit and Helite vest, which deployed, saving his back, chest and neck.

I consider an airbag vest/jacket as just as essential as a helmet when riding.
 
I'll try to make this short. Like @Erdoc48, I won't ride without one.

I got interested in one after reading of a member of NT-Owners.org who was in an accident. He was an experienced rider and leading a small group. The road turned, he didn't. His gear protected him from abrasions and head injury. The rest of him wasn't so lucky. I think he had 17 broken bones in his ribs. One cracked vertebrae and one fractured? To make a long story short, he was touch and go for months afterwards and I don't believe he's ridden afterwards. If he'd had an airbag vest, he could've walked away from it, I believe.

You can go fancy. I didn't. First, the technology wasn't available back then. Plus, I'm convinced the technology does little good. I have a Hit-Air vest. It operates with a tether that I have attached to the frame in front of the seat. Fit is sized to wear over your gear. If it goes off, and it has several times, I simply screw in a new CO2 cannister and put it on. No sensors to be recalibrated.

The first time it went off, I was heading to the prison at rush-hour. I came up to a busy intersection to turn right and immediately noticed the cars on the right side of the intersection were just beginning to move. It was a large intersection, so if I got moving now, I'd be ahead of all the traffic on the left that was also just starting to move. I let out the clutch. Right foot wasn't yet on the footpeg...and a teenager with a skateboard walked in front of me. My fault. I didn't look for pedestrians and he had every right to do what he did. But I still had to stop before hitting him.

I grabbed the front brake...no choice as the right foot wasn't up to the peg yet...and promptly proved you can't beat physics or gravity. The next thing I saw after seeing the kid was the sky. I'm checking my body and realizing that I don't feel any pain. (My ego was severely bruised though!) My left side is lying right on the upper edge of the curb and I should've cracked some ribs at least. Then I thought, "Oh, the air bag..." I squeezed the air out of the air bag and went on to the prison.

I'm on my second Hit-Air vest. The first one finally wore out. The outside looked great, but the plastic airbag was deteriorating from heat and sunlight. I bought the same exact one. No doubt in my mind.

The tether has pulled me up short when I tried to walk away, but never deployed. The tether system may seem technically out of date, but it works. There's nothing to fail on it. And while the sensors can state they work faster, the bottom line question is will it work fast enough. I've had mine deploy probably 4 times now and it has always worked.

What areas does it protect? A lot more than you'd think. The chest and back rib cages seem obvious. The backbone should be protected by your jacket's back protector. Less obvious is that the vest protects the neck and collarbones. And at the bottom, it protects the tailbone. Between the Helite and the Hit-Air, I think the Hit-Air protects more. You'll want to check for yourself though. Designs change.

I would not buy one that is built into the jacket itself. What do you do when you change jackets? If you buy one with sensors and it requires sending it in to be checked...are you going to stop riding? Or ride without? If it was something you deemed necessary for riding, why would you ever ride without it for two weeks while it is in the mail?

If you got more questions, send me a PM.

Chris
 
Daboo said:
I'll try to make this short. Like @Erdoc48, I won't ride without one.

I got interested in one after reading of a member of NT-Owners.org who was in an accident. He was an experienced rider and leading a small group. The road turned, he didn't. His gear protected him from abrasions and head injury. The rest of him wasn't so lucky. I think he had 17 broken bones in his ribs. One cracked vertebrae and one fractured? To make a long story short, he was touch and go for months afterwards and I don't believe he's ridden afterwards. If he'd had an airbag vest, he could've walked away from it, I believe.

You can go fancy. I didn't. First, the technology wasn't available back then. Plus, I'm convinced the technology does little good. I have a Hit-Air vest. It operates with a tether that I have attached to the frame in front of the seat. Fit is sized to wear over your gear. If it goes off, and it has several times, I simply screw in a new CO2 cannister and put it on. No sensors to be recalibrated.

The first time it went off, I was heading to the prison at rush-hour. I came up to a busy intersection to turn right and immediately noticed the cars on the right side of the intersection were just beginning to move. It was a large intersection, so if I got moving now, I'd be ahead of all the traffic on the left that was also just starting to move. I let out the clutch. Right foot wasn't yet on the footpeg...and a teenager with a skateboard walked in front of me. My fault. I didn't look for pedestrians and he had every right to do what he did. But I still had to stop before hitting him.

I grabbed the front brake...no choice as the right foot wasn't up to the peg yet...and promptly proved you can't beat physics or gravity. The next thing I saw after seeing the kid was the sky. I'm checking my body and realizing that I don't feel any pain. (My ego was severely bruised though!) My left side is lying right on the upper edge of the curb and I should've cracked some ribs at least. Then I thought, "Oh, the air bag..." I squeezed the air out of the air bag and went on to the prison.

I'm on my second Hit-Air vest. The first one finally wore out. The outside looked great, but the plastic airbag was deteriorating from heat and sunlight. I bought the same exact one. No doubt in my mind.

The tether has pulled me up short when I tried to walk away, but never deployed. The tether system may seem technically out of date, but it works. There's nothing to fail on it. And while the sensors can state they work faster, the bottom line question is will it work fast enough. I've had mine deploy probably 4 times now and it has always worked.

What areas does it protect? A lot more than you'd think. The chest and back rib cages seem obvious. The backbone should be protected by your jacket's back protector. Less obvious is that the vest protects the neck and collarbones. And at the bottom, it protects the tailbone. Between the Helite and the Hit-Air, I think the Hit-Air protects more. You'll want to check for yourself though. Designs change.

I would not buy one that is built into the jacket itself. What do you do when you change jackets? If you buy one with sensors and it requires sending it in to be checked...are you going to stop riding? Or ride without? If it was something you deemed necessary for riding, why would you ever ride without it for two weeks while it is in the mail?

If you got more questions, send me a PM.

Chris
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These are all excellent points and I agree with them all.
 
As Uncle Phil's questions have mostly been answered now, here and elsewhere across our wet-wild-web, I'm not as sensitive to possibly hijacking his thread.
While I still will call myself an ATGATT rider, I'm not yet sold on the vest concept. Or, if I am, I'm not ready to spend close to a thou on one.
Would they help? I think we can agree that yes, in most common crash scenarios, they will save broken bones and maybe more.
One aspect not talked about (much) in this thread is the pros and cons of inside the jacket, or outside. Inside, it's entirely possible you'll have the wind knocked out of you if worn under a jacket when it inflates, which of course is temporary and not the largest concern, in the big picture view. And it may feel restrictive worn inside your existing jacket, that will vary of course.
Worn externally, the vest risks being ripped, torn or punctured while sliding after a crash, or upon impact with something sharp or pointy, and all of that will likewise obviously vary from incident to incident.
Not that I'm adding anything to the discussion, but in the end, I'm not ready to become accustomed to the device, whether inside / outside or tethered / electronic.
Another safety device I'm ambivalent over is the Leatt brace fitted on the shoulders and under the helmet, such as we see Noraly wear.
Interestingly, although the potential AND documented benefits of both the Leatt and the airbag are pretty much inarguable, these two pieces of safety gear are not compatible with one another.
Last point: Adventure Rider Radio has separate episodes discussing each of these devices, pros and cons, including an interview with the South African physician who invented the Leatt (oddly enough, his name is Dr. Leatt.)
 
Daboo said:
I'm on my second Hit-Air vest. The first one finally wore out. The outside looked great, but the plastic airbag was deteriorating from heat and sunlight.
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I'm curious how you determined it was time to replace it. I don't recall seeing anything from Helite other than send it back for inspection after six deployments or when there is visible damage. Maybe Hit-Air is different?
 
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