Honda DCT: Pros and Cons?

ST Gui

ST Gui

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ST1300, 2010
The mention of here of Honda bringing out new GoldWings— one possibly in DCT only got me wondering about Honda 'automatic' transmissions. I knew very little about them. A former girlfriend had a 400 Suzi with a 2-speed range A/T and there was her Honda Elite scooter. This video was particularly informative:

[video=youtube;cuMt88e3aTc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cuMt88e3aTc&feature=youtu.be[/video]

Not that I'm ever going to be buying another bike again (unless my ST becomes too heavy to handle and I can still ride) I'm still really interested in hands-on rider experiences with Honda's DCT.

My GoldWing buddy likes the look of the new 'Wing and might consider replacing his 2005 Big Bird. Having ridden manual shifting bikes only near 60yrs I'm wondering what DCT might offer him and could he handle the climate change LOL.

My main curiousness is the ride/handling aspect more so than the cost and maintenance perspectives. So you guys and gals who've ridden Honda's DCT bike(s)— whaddya think good bad indifferent.
 
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I test rode an African Twin with DCT, it was OK, but before I knew it, it was in 6th gear at 40mph. The up shifts were basically smooth, you could feel the downshifts as you slowed down.

Unless you were going for an extended test ride (like the whole day) it would be hard to adjudicate it fairly. There are different modes that affect how the bike shifts, and it would take some time to get that figured out in order to pick the right mode for the type of ride you wish to do.

If you weren't concerned about the style of riding and you basically wanted to get from point A to B without any issues, it works flawlessly.

The bottom line , I think there's a learning curve and once you have it mastered you may never go back to a traditional transmission again.

I still like my manual transmission and will hang onto that as long as I'm able
 
I've ridden the DCT CTX 700 and I didn't care for it. Not that there was anything wrong with it, but like kiltman I could feel the shifts, mostly downshifting, uuuuh BAM uuuh BAM and accelerating you were in top gear very quickly upshifting with minor quicker bams...uh bam uh bam uh bam. I'm not anti automatic, my CVT Majesty scooter was a great ride, and I enjoyed a ride on a Zero electric as well. I only rode the CTX one hour and I didn't play with modes much, so I am not anti DCT either until I get some more experience with them. I'm told by those that live with them it turns out to be a great experience.
 
I had a couple of friends that had 750 hondamatics. They both loved the bikes. I don't know what the difference between the new auto and the old.
 
Ahhh...MY TOPIC! I have been researching this for over 4+ years. WHY? I have MS, cannot use my toes/foot to shift upwards. Thus, a DCT or AE (FJR paddle electronic shift) is awesome. Many..just don't get it. They think when you say "DCT or Paddle Shift" they think a automatic mode tranny. Nothing could be further from the idea. FIRST: DCT/Electronic shift vehicles have been used many, many, years. Your drag cars go so fast- THEY require paddle shift. Look at F1 race cars.
A DCT or Electronic shift tranny can shift in as little as .02 tenths of a second. NO missed shifts. The FJR AE can use 3 modes. Foot shift, paddle shift, or a typical true 'auto-shift." DCT differs in the Yamaha 'electric' design by a TRUE dual clutch seamless change of gears. If you were to TRY a DCT- I really don't think you'd ever go back to a foot shifter. All at your fingertips. With Honda & Yamaha's systems...yes, you can have 'engine-braking' just by downshifting as you would w/the foot-shifter.
Unfortunately- Dealers never pushed or showed the feature to new buyers. Or had a Demo bike available. Unfortunately- Yamaha made their AE Paddle Shift FJR from 2006-2010 ONLY. (Still sold in other Countries though....as they understand the unique concept.) I'm ready for one now. I have a special heel-toe shifter now. But, I'm wanting the DCT or Electronic paddle shift ; in a Sport Tourer. We'll see.... GO FOR IT HONDA!
 
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I too have MS, so until I can't shift I will keep on with the manual. I forgot about the paddle shift, and I did try that out on the test ride and I did enjoy that feature. Thanks ST1300doug for reminding me about that.
 
kiltman said:
I too have MS, so until I can't shift I will keep on with the manual. I forgot about the paddle shift, and I did try that out on the test ride and I did enjoy that feature. Thanks ST1300doug for reminding me about that.
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Here is what I went to in 2010- when I contracted the MS. Works like a jem. Just not near as fast as a DCT/Paddle Shift.
 

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I've ridden an African Twin DCT....found it butter smooth. You can choose a couple of different modes...and you always can go to manual. Loved it....no negatives in my mind. The added price is justified.
 
I use the clutch and rear brake for maneuvering at low speed. For those with DCT experience, how did you perceive the low speed handling without a clutch? (I've ridden Zeros, and not noticed any difficulties, but the electric bike may be a different animal.)
 
I've worn out the first set of Pirelli's on my VFR1200X-DCT after a little over ten thousand km. Riding with the DCT has been great, no regrets. The fact that you can't stall it, makes low speed parking lot U-turns easier. Stop and go traffic, less of an aggravation. But my favourite feature is the ease of aggressive twisties riding. Just trust your tires, and lean! You'll be in the right gear always. The sport mode setting makes for entertaining shift points, and you quickly learn that the computer is clever. So much so, that I'd say it understands the joy of riding! http://en.honda-dct.com/
 
catcher said:
The fact that you can't stall it, makes low speed parking lot U-turns easier. Stop and go traffic, less of an aggravation.
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That never occurred to me. I've had to dab more than once in making a U-turn. I never thought of it for Stop and Go traffic even though that's the reason I never owned a manual transmission car. I can drive one but have no desire to own one.

It's just as well that Honda doesn't make something like CB1100EX with DCT. I could be tempted...

I saw that video when I found the one I posted. The music alone made me want to visit a dealer.
 
Truthfully.....it's hard to argue...it works. And very well. Why most want to say...it's NOT a TRUE motorcycle? Really?! It'd be nice if Honda would allow it to be a feature....you could order for several Models....if some remained hard-headed to the manual shifting. Dunno?
 
IIRC the Cub 50 and some early model Hondas came from the factory with the heel-toe shifter.
 
If I bought a GoldWing...they sell a 'heel-toe' shifter for around $135.... mmmmmmmm?
 
st1300doug said:
Just not near as fast as a DCT/Paddle Shift.
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But faster than the OEM shifter were that a consideration.

That's a nice bit of kit. Is it one off or can anybody else get it?
 
Honda put a lot of thought and engineering into DCT technology and they are not done with it yet. I've owned a 2015 NC700X DCT for a couple years and just under 25,000 miles. The VFR1200F was equipped with the 1st generation DCT. 700s (2012-2015 NC700X and CTX700s) have the 2nd generation DCT. The VFR1200X, the Africa Twin and 2016-17 700s are in the 3rd generation. If so equipped the new Goldwing will likely have further refinements to previous generations.

I am completely sold on the DCT. Between the choices of different modes of automatic and manual operation plus the ability to override automatic upshifts and downshifts with the thumb and finger paddles the system is very versatile at handling different rider abilities and expectations. If you want to set it and forget it or aggressively attack corners and everything in between it can pretty much handle what you ask of it. In fast spirited riding I typically handle downshifts into the corners and let it handle upshifts out of corners. It shifts so quickly and seamlessly that acceleration upshifts when leaned on the edge of the tire do not upset the bike's suspension. It frees up the brain to concentrate on braking and picking the line into and out of the corner. I had a manual transmission NC700X for 30,000 miles and like the DCT bike better. At the end of a long day riding my ST1300 I miss the ability to choose an automatic mode for the ride home. The DCT is going to appeal to many touring riders and to commuters that are constantly in and out of start/stop cycles. DCT does add 20-25 lbs of weight and it is completely dependent on a clean source of 12V electricity but in the latter it is no different than fuel injection or ABS.

Slow speed maneuvers done in the friction zone of a manually clutched motorcycle where we balance a slipped clutch against rear brake are just as easily done on DCT as a manual. The pro of DCT here is that the bike will never ever stall and the clutch is handled perfectly each and every time. The clutch "hand" never tires and it never makes a mistake. A con of DCT is a good rider can downshift smoother in certain situations. A work around this con is to flick the box into a less aggressive mode where it down shifts later at lower rpms when coming to a stop then flick back into a sport mode when accelerating. A good rider on a DCT bike will learn to use all of the modes to optimize the way the DCT operates. To illustrate how easily DCT handles friction zone maneuvers I made this quickie video a while back:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvbqgmTzwIU
 
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ST Gui said:
attachment.php


But faster than the OEM shifter were that a consideration.

That's a nice bit of kit. Is it one off or can anybody else get it?
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The World-Known fabricator- Norm Wilding of MidMissouri M/C has made and sold quite a few of these. Just GOOGLE his name & the MidMissouri Motorcycles.
 
dduelin said:
I am completely sold on the DCT.
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Thanks for your thorough post. While not in the market for a new bike DCT is sounding more and more compelling all the time.

I'm having the same issue with your link as is Jim.


st1300doug said:
The World-Known fabricator- Norm Wilding of MidMissouri M/C
Click to expand...

Thanks for that info!
 
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