U-Turn technique

SMSW

Joined
Sep 4, 2013
Messages
8,071
Location
Cleveland
Bike
2010 ST1300
This week I was out riding with a few friends (there were 14 of us) in rural south east Ohio. We were following a narrow, serpentine, hilly road that was mostly asphalt with some gravel stretches. Our leader had mapped the course, driven it from end to end a few days previously and seen no construction. Today, we encountered 'road closed' signs but decided to push on, assuming we would be able to get by the construction, if indeed it had started. This road dipped down, crossed a stream (creek) and ascended another hill on the other side.

We crested a hill and looked down on a big yellow excavator but were unable to see (because of curves and the hill) what was being done. About half of us descended to find a large cleared area just above the low point. While it had appeared level from above, it was actually canted toward the right side of the road and tilted downward. A drainage slope on the right side of the road led water down to the creek, and the excavator had dug a big trench across the road in preparation for the new culvert that was being installed.

There was obviously no good place to turn around. The road was hard packed dirt/gravel with a lot of loose ball bearings, oops, gravel, on top. Without discussing the wisdom (or lack thereof) of passing the construction signs, my question concerns a technique for turning around in a narrow space that is canted in two directions. To end speculation, most everyone successfully negotiated the turn, some backing and forthing more than others. I dropped my ST 4 times. There was absolutely no firm footing and I'm relatively short. Each time I tried to shift into gear and hold the bike upright, I lost my footing and over we went. A couple of times I stopped inching forward, began backing, and over I went. The construction guys helped me right the bike, and I escaped without a scratch (thank you Honda, and Bygdawg). Once pointed roughly uphill, I was able to ride out. (Most of the guys were either atop the hill waiting for the rest of us or wrestling with their own bikes. Two saw my difficulty and had dismounted and were helping me.)

Many years ago, I fooled around on my lighter, lower, Triumph. I goosed the gas and skidded the rear end around on a dirt/gravel road. Is this even possible on an ST? Or would it lead to a moving crash and damage to the bike? Is there a farkle available that will turn the ST into a 300 lb off road bike for a few minutes when needed? Maybe a genie in a lamp carried in the topbox?
 
I feel your pain! Twice now, I have gotten into areas which were too steep for me to back the bike up, or, as in your case, were canted in odd directions, making it difficult or impossible to turn the bike around. I am a bit taller, ( 34" inseam) and it DOES NOT help a lot!

In one case, I got lucky, as a passerby saw my problem, and helped me push the bike backwards to the street, where I could manage it, in the other case, I ended up physically picking up the back end of the bike, and moving it into position.

Despite it's ease of handling, it's a heavy oinker when standing still.
 
There is no better wisdom than first hand experience! Dropping an ST1300 four times and emerging from it unscathed is a good outcome. The lessons learned... count it for gain. If it were me, I would have asked the excavator operator to pick the bike up with a sling and spin it around for me... Well it never hurts to ask.
 
This is like the joke "How do you get to Carnegie Hall? "Practice".

Practice first in a parking lot. Two standard spaces are 18' wide or the width of a narrow country road. When you can U and circle in 18' or less without thinking about it you have the confidence that you can turn around on most any road you will travel. Standard lanes are 9 to 12 feet wide between markings and most have a foot or more outside the markings.

I really had no choice with a 28" inseam. This bike was not going to master me and the ST with it's standard engine guards is perfect to learn how to execute slow speed maneuvers on a big heavy bike. A slow speed drop only scuffs the $13 plastic cover.
 
Also turn your head and look where you want to go, not at the front of the bike. Sometimes this means looking back over you shoulder. Bike goes where you are looking much easier.

I agree with dduelin, find a parking lot and practice. Use the lines on the payment as boundaries. I also suggest taking a advance rider class. They will teach you a few tricks that help you manage the bike.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
 
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ddueling offers great advice.
If you are in a group, and it gets dicey, it is not a bad idea to get the bikes turned around one at a time. ie. everyone dismount and then all support one rider at a time until all are safely turned or through the obstacle.
 
In a situation like this, with a few other riders (and construction workers) around, I would have dismounted - bike on side stand - and asked for a few guys to help muscle the 700 pound beastie around into the right direction. A loose gravelly surface, on a slope no less, is no place to demonstrate your ability to get out of a tricky situation on your own.
 
Practice in a parking lot might help...... but sloped gravel covered roads with a 750 lb street bike are different!!!
Practice on same roads with a lighter bike possible?
STs are good, but they are heavy SOBs out of their element!!!
 
Believe it or not, it's possible to spin the ST on the centerstand. Had to do this once. Made a lot of noise, but did a perfect 180 degree pivot.
 
Ozzie said:
Believe it or not, it's possible to spin the ST on the centerstand. Had to do this once. Made a lot of noise, but did a perfect 180 degree pivot.
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On a gravel surface sloped in two directions?
Getting on/off the centerstand would guarantee a drop!
 
Bush said:
In a situation like this, with a few other riders (and construction workers) around, I would have dismounted - bike on side stand - and asked for a few guys to help muscle the 700 pound beastie around into the right direction. A loose gravelly surface, on a slope no less, is no place to demonstrate your ability to get out of a tricky situation on your own.
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I done this with dual sports and dirt bikes. It would be a handy trick to have in your toolbox. Anyone actually done this with an ST?

While power sliding an ST around is theoretically possible, I'd never try it and I've done it lots on dirt bikes. What I have done is tap the rear brake on my old ST1100 on a banked road to get the rear wheel to slide a little (very little) to help with a turn around. I don't know how that would work on an ST1300 with linked brakes.

Only pointers I can help with is really really really feather the clutch so only just enough power to barely move is going to the back wheel. Head and eyes up to maintain balance as best you can (practice on pavement ahead of time). Once the ST starts to lean and you have to put your foot down, you're pretty much done for and the bike is going to go over since your foot will slide on the gravel. If you have any choice, try to fall to the uphill side as it is MUCH easier to pick up.
 
Look for an escape route (direction you want to go) plant a foot, and twist the throttle! Maintain forward movement, while steering with the throttle. Never cover/apply the front brake lever while doing this.
I've had to do this a couple times on gravel fire roads that dead ended. Its best to keep moving and steer with the throttle. Listen to your inner dirt bike rider :rofl1: You'll end up doing a both feet up power slide, spinning tires, and throwing gravel everywhere, and impress the heck out of your friends :squid1:
 
Why I don't take mine off road! (Read that "Off Pavement"! :D

No gravel/dirt/etc. roads for me!
 
scootac said:
Practice in a parking lot might help...... but sloped gravel covered roads with a 750 lb street bike are different!!!
Practice on same roads with a lighter bike possible?
STs are good, but they are heavy SOBs out of their element!!!
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My practice does include sloped lots, lots with broken pebbly surface, in the corner of the lot hemmed in by the curbs on two sides, etc. circles with the bike nearly upright and circles with the bike leaned steeply but I enjoy it so increasing difficult situations are situations I seek out so if I'm faced with a difficult situation I at least have some tools to work with - and anybody could do the same on any size or weight bike. Up to the rider to choose what skills to learn.

Sure, the description was of a surface that was impossible to handle but with confidence comes a different set of eyes. I have a high drop count because I was never scared of trying.
 
Your feet down on loose gravel is bad. No matter how you do it. You need to be little more aggressive on the throttle and just turn the bike. Look ahead. Don't be afraid of a little wheel spinning and sloshing around. Once she starts pulling and sliding ride it out. Keep good clutch control.

You need to get that bike out in some mud! You'll learn how to control it!! Lol
 
jonz said:
Anyone actually done this with an ST?

While power sliding an ST around is theoretically possible, I'd never try it and I've done it lots on dirt bikes. If you have any choice, try to fall to the uphill side as it is MUCH easier to pick up.
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I'm very interested in the answer to that question. And, so far, I've not been very lucky to choose which side my ST tips over. It usually goes when my foot slides out or finds nothing at all (once upon a pothole).

dduelin said:
Sure, the description was of a surface that was impossible to handle but with confidence comes a different set of eyes. I have a high drop count because I was never scared of trying.
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I agree, Dave. I now see parking lots and other dead end avenues differently than I used to because of my difficulty horsing the bike around w/ the engine off. And I too have a high drop count - and I'm not afraid of dropping or being embarrassed (this comes w/ experience).

OhioDeere said:
Your feet down on loose gravel is bad. No matter how you do it. You need to be little more aggressive on the throttle and just turn the bike. Look ahead. Don't be afraid of a little wheel spinning and sloshing around. Once she starts pulling and sliding ride it out. Keep good clutch control.

You need to get that bike out in some mud! You'll learn how to control it!! Lol
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One of our group turned her bike around by inching over a wet area. I avoided that because I knew I was going to come out of it with more mud on me than I wanted. And picking up the bike in the mud? No way. This area ended up being firm and aside from the gravel, posed her no problems (BMW GS).

At a BMW dealer's open house a few weeks ago there was a video running in an endless loop. A factory rider was doing wheelies, stoppies, skidding the rear tire around with the throttle, all the little tricks that kids on Betas or GasGas bikes do regularly, only this was a full sized Beemer in a parking lot (asphalt). If he can do it, then I have to assume the answer to my (and jonz') question is 'yes'.

Doug, Mike, we can talk about this at OHSTOC.
 
I got myself into a pickle once on a semi-paved, gravel strewn road that was going down hill. Not enough room to do a traditional u-turn and not enough grip to do the low speed lean where you push the bike down under you, whilst keeping your body mostly upright. Footing was poor and uneven, and worse I was all by myself. After ruminating on it a bit I decided to remove the seat so that I could get more solid footing when astride the bike. It worked! I was able to secure more solid footing to perform the back and forthing (backing up hill no less) to get turned around. Once I got the bike up to a better place I just parked and hiked back down to retrieve my seat.
 
SMSW said:
we encountered 'road closed' signs but decided to push on
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Just like the saying in aviation, a good pilot uses his superior judgement so he doesn't have to use his superior skills. All this talk about the tight turns and such is a good conversation... I am just curious if it was out of courtesy or fear of a gang lashing that no one has brought up why one would put himself into that situation in the first place, disregarding their own safety and that of his fellow riders. Anyways I don't type this out of disrespect, I just know posting signs is done generally to protect a person from themselves. Now easy on the retorts if you feel you must.
 
wjbertrand said:
After ruminating on it a bit I decided to remove the seat so that I could get more solid footing when astride the bike.
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That's brilliant. I'm not particularly height-challenged, but there may be a time that I can use that tip. That is, if I can remember it... sometimes I'm memory-challenged:)
 
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